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  #16   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 03:24
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calianna
But in reality, fast food doesn't even taste that good. All it really has is the addictive trifecta of fat, salt, and carbs.


This is why the business is currently going so big.

Olive oil in the Starbucks coffee. Bacon in the milkshakes. Your favorite iced summer coffee could contain 46 teaspoons of sugar — the same as drinking 5 cans of Coke.

And that's what we know, and what's LEGAL. In today's business climate I would put nothing past them.

Quote:
"Ultra-Processed People: Why We Can't Stop Eating Food That Isn't Food" by Chris van Tulleken -

"We know that low doses of lots of chemicals that are either added to food or that end up in food from pesticides or packaging can damage the thyroid. Polybrominated-diphenyl-ethers, perchlorate, organophosphate pesticides, per- and polyfluoroalkyl substances (PFAS), bisphenol A, nitrates and ortho-phthalates can all disrupt various aspects of the thyroid hormone system."


This is all allowed in our food until someone makes a fuss, like BPA. And I'm sure it all multiplies each other's effect, creating synergy, just like they look for a mix of artificial sweeteners, each of which is cheaper than sugar. Like the business process that gave us High Fructose Corn Syrup.

People don't even know there's iodine in the salt. Much less what food is doing to our thyroids.
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  #17   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 05:33
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JEY100 JEY100 is online now
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Plan: P:E/DDF
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That's how Chris suggests breaking the addiction to fast food. Read that sentence about all the chemicals in food WHILE you are eating a serving of Chicken Nuggets! The Satiety of Nuggets is a fraction of baked chicken strips. Or read the list of 55 ingredients in a ChikFilA chicken sandwich. https://foodbabe.com/here-are-the-5...d-you-eat-them/

"Nutrition is about Nutrients. Everything else is just Noise"* My symptoms of hypothyroidism were reduced when I increased the seafood and vegetables in my diet…but maybe I was reducing chemicals too? I certainly was no longer adding the occasional ChikFilA meal to my diet.
* Optimising Nutrition revised tag line.

This Genius Life podcast starting at minute 13, is Dr Naiman's complete explanation of satiety using the difference between chicken and chicken nuggets. It includes the P:E ratio, protein amount, refined oils and carbs, energy density, nutrient density, and even the hedonic factor. A few minutes using a practical example and the effect of processing changes the satiety from high to very low. Chicken nuggets do not equal chicken.

https://thegeniuslife.libsyn.com/we...n-ted-naiman-md

Last edited by JEY100 : Thu, Jan-11-24 at 07:22.
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  #18   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 07:51
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Calianna Calianna is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBear
~snip~

People don't even know there's iodine in the salt. Much less what food is doing to our thyroids.


Just yesterday I was reading about iodine in fast food - or rather the lack of iodized salt in fast food.

I was wondering at the time if there was any iodine at all in pink salt, which also led to information about Celtic sea salt. There is naturally occurring iodine in those, but significantly less than in iodized salt.

Anyhow, I ended up falling into the "rabbit hole" list of Q&A about salt on the Google list, there were several questions relating to whether or not fast food companies used iodized salt.

For the most part, it sounded like fast food places don't use iodized salt in their food. Some places it specifically said the salt used in the food production process at several fast food places, and what is delivered to individual stores that they use to salt fries or burgers on the grill is not iodized. One source said that sometimes a shipment of iodized salt will be delivered to an individual store, but I didn't go any further down that particular rabbit hole to find out why one individual store and not others.

They specifically pointed out that the little salt packets at McD's do not have iodine in them.

I decided to climb out of the rabbit hole at that point, so hard to tell what other bits of information might have shown up about the salt used for specific fast food restaurants.
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  #19   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 10:31
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JEY100 JEY100 is online now
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Plan: P:E/DDF
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If you want to resume your "rabbit hole adventure". this is a very good article about iodine. https://optimisingnutrition.com/bes...rces-of-iodine/
BUT, Unfortunately, because iodine in food is so variable depending on where it’s grown, it is often not tracked in food databases.. Chronometer doesn't even have an entry for it.

Because I was only using pink Himalayan and Kosher salt (neither have it) I supplemented for a while and then changed the salt purchased. I vaguely ate "more seafood" but gave up trying to put a number it.

Last edited by JEY100 : Thu, Jan-11-24 at 10:58.
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  #20   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 10:59
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cotonpal cotonpal is online now
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  #21   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 17:24
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Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calianna
<...snip...>
But in reality, fast food doesn't even taste that good. All it really has is the addictive trifecta of fat, salt, and carbs.<...>

I agree. Once you get used to real food, the fast food doesn't taste that good.

But zillions of people think it tastes great. They have been conditioned to think that's what food is supposed to taste like.

Fat, salt, and carbs are what flavors good and bad food alike. But IMO butter tastes much better than soybean oil, and so on.
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  #22   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 17:31
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JEY100 JEY100 is online now
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Jean, The Maine Coast Sea Vegetables company looks very interesting. Is this is the version of salt and sea vegetables that you use to get iodine naturally? And use in place of salt on the table? The label looks familiar to me, and it is on Amazon if I just want to try one canister, but many products are intriguing. Thanks for the info!

Last edited by JEY100 : Thu, Jan-11-24 at 17:47.
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  #23   ^
Old Thu, Jan-11-24, 18:25
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cotonpal cotonpal is online now
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Yes, that is what I use for salt that also gives me naturally occurring iodine. I also buy this product:

https://seaveg.com/collections/seas...s-blend-organic

and add it to salads. I figure I get my required amount of iodine this way.
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  #24   ^
Old Fri, Jan-12-24, 04:18
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JEY100 JEY100 is online now
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Plan: P:E/DDF
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
Yes, that is what I use for salt that also gives me naturally occurring iodine. I also buy this product:

https://seaveg.com/collections/seas...s-blend-organic

and add it to salads. I figure I get my required amount of iodine this way.

Even more iodine, also looks good! Thank you for the recommendation.
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  #25   ^
Old Fri, Jan-12-24, 06:57
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WereBear WereBear is offline
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I like seafood and use seaweed wraps for sandwiches. I don't measure, but I am taking a course of iodine tablets to help with an autoimmune outbreak caused by a dental amount of Ibuprofen. I'm never touching an NSAID again.

I think such reactions aren't rare. They are simply called something else.
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  #26   ^
Old Fri, Jan-12-24, 17:04
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Calianna Calianna is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob-a-rama
I agree. Once you get used to real food, the fast food doesn't taste that good.

But zillions of people think it tastes great. They have been conditioned to think that's what food is supposed to taste like.

Fat, salt, and carbs are what flavors good and bad food alike. But IMO butter tastes much better than soybean oil, and so on.


Most of us grew up on real food though - at least most of us growing up in the 50's and 60's.

I grew up on very plain, bland foods. If anything attracted me to fast food it was that KFC actually used some herbs on their chicken, McD's used "Special Sauce" or a combination of toppings, and everything had more salt on it

So it's still the increased amounts of salt, fat, and carbs. It wasn't really good, just a little more flavor than what I grew up with, so it seemed better.


Oh I should mention that it wasn't just the fast food salt, fat, and carb combination that attracted me to fast food - as an adult with children, I also liked the fact that it was a meal I didn't need to cook, and cleaning up was as easy as just throwing away the wrappers, instead of cleaning pots and pans and washing dishes.

(but that was before I started using that menu service and learned how to make foods with real flavor)
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  #27   ^
Old Sat, Jan-13-24, 03:19
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WereBear WereBear is offline
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I think the stage of civilization we are in might be called "the cheap version of luxury."

Cheap furniture, but it can't be moved to a new place. Cheap clothes, that can't survive much washing. Cheap food we don't have to cook or clean up after.

Except, it's not exactly food. We can't mess with that the way we can furniture and clothes.
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  #28   ^
Old Sat, Jan-13-24, 09:51
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Calianna Calianna is online now
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBear
I think the stage of civilization we are in might be called "the cheap version of luxury."

Cheap furniture, but it can't be moved to a new place. Cheap clothes, that can't survive much washing. Cheap food we don't have to cook or clean up after.

Except, it's not exactly food. We can't mess with that the way we can furniture and clothes.


We do live in what is very much a "throw-away" era.

My parents grew up during the Great Depression - NOTHING was thrown away until it was completely unusable, because they might need it - "Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without" was the mantra for that time. Mend the rip in your clothes, and when completely worn out, still save the worn out clothes for cleaning rags - after removing and saving all the buttons and zippers, snaps and hooks of course, because you might need those for something else. Many times those buttons evoke memories of the exact piece of clothing they were salvaged from.

Fast food has gone completely in the opposite direction - the packaging gets thrown away immediately after consuming the food. The effects of the "food" will probably live on your body forever (unless you completely change your diet - and even then, it might stubbornly stick around), although the food itself is as transient as last season's must-have fashion - forgettable, except the draw to have more of that particular fat-salt-carb combo again.

It's why so many people get so excited about the occasional return of the McRib sandwich - WHY? They don't even know what's in it, only that thoughts of it piqued a particular craving for the same fat-salt-carb combo.



Back to the original topic of this thread - Will the weight loss drugs kill the fast food industry?

My guess is still no. They may struggle for a while as more and more people start taking the weight loss drugs and aren't as hungry/can't eat as much.

But fast food companies are good at adapting - they figure out what they need to do to continue to attract customers and do it.

In this case, it may be offering a line of foods somehow (chemically?) adapted to the diminished stomach capacity of the person on weight loss drugs, while still appealing to the taste and mouth feel of those addicted to their standard menu.
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  #29   ^
Old Sat, Jan-13-24, 18:48
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Bob-a-rama Bob-a-rama is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calianna
Most of us grew up on real food though - at least most of us growing up in the 50's and 60's.

I grew up on very plain, bland foods. <...snip...>
I'm a picky eater, and don't like foods too spicy. In fact, if you give me something that has a noticeable garlic or onion taste, it'll come back up immediately. It's been that way since I was a child.

I've read that my body can't digest the particular sugar they contain, but I haven't had any tests to verify that.

And hot? The plants evolved those tastes as a defense against animals trying to eat them. Who am I to argue?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calianna
We do live in what is very much a "throw-away" era.

My parents grew up during the Great Depression - NOTHING was thrown away until it was completely unusable, because they might need it - "Use it up, wear it out, make it do, or do without" was the mantra for that time. Mend the rip in your clothes, and when completely worn out, still save the worn out clothes for cleaning rags - after removing and saving all the buttons and zippers, snaps and hooks of course, because you might need those for something else. Many times those buttons evoke memories of the exact piece of clothing they were salvaged from. <...>


It's the downside of corporate economy.

In a small business, the owner needs to make enough profit to pay the help, and make extra for himself/herself. As long as increasing profits keep up with inflation, more is better, but not necessary.

In a corporation, typically 49% of the stockholders do not work for the company, and do nothing physical or mental in the corporation at all.

BUT, the stock has to increase, much greater than the inflation rate, or there is no sense holding the stock. If it doesn't increase, the stockholder sells.

That means the corporation requires perpetually increasing profit. How to do that? One way is to shorten product span, and make it so it cannot be repaired. Fashion is all about this, don't be caught wearing last year's styles, even if the clothes are still in good shape. Get a new iPhone, even if the one you have works perfectly. Get that air-fryer, instant pot or whatever the fad is this year, because the stockholders need the money.

I don't know of a better economic system, but alas, that is this one's downside.

Back on topic.

I think weight loss drugs will benefit the fast food industry. Our drives are fight, flight, feed, and reproduce (the four Fs). If we can take a pill to lose weight, bring on the whoppers, donuts, pop tarts, french fries, and so-on. I can eat like a pig, and still stay slim — yum yum.

I read in the past, people ate tapeworms so they could eat more and stay slim. It didn't matter that the worms were absorbing their nutrients, as long as they ate enough to keep the weight off.

For most of us, our drives (the 4 Fs) are stronger than our reasoning ability. It's part of our survival instincts. Eat now, winter or another starvation season is coming, and before food preservation, those that didn't, perished.

If there was a magic pill, that had zero side effects, that enabled me to eat donuts, fried potatoes, and pecan pie and kept me slim, I'd be tempted.

The problem is, every drug has its side effects, and those can be worse than the cure. But not everyone has this mindset. What? A pill that lets me pork out on junk food, and not get fat? Bring it on...
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  #30   ^
Old Thu, Feb-29-24, 07:00
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WereBear WereBear is offline
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Quote:
These studies estimate that 6.7% of hospitalized patients have a serious adverse drug reaction with a fatality rate of 0.32%. If these estimates are correct, then there are more than 2,216,000 serious ADRs in hospitalized patients, causing over 106,000 deaths annually. Mar 6, 2018

Preventable Adverse Drug Reactions
https://www.fda.gov/drugs/drug-inte...ug-interactions


Two million events, and over a hundred thousand dead, all because of a drug... that might not be anywhere near life-saving. It's part of my drug-aversion tactics, after it was the only thing offered to help with my autoimmune. Which I didn't think was life-threatening. Now, they would insist, because early signs are now seen as that dangerous. Which is progress, except in treatment.

But unless it happens to them or someone they know, no one pays attention. I had a horrible reaction to prescribed high doses of ibuprofen and suffered for two months. And since it did get better, I hope I got off lightly.

They have lost sight of drugs that actually address the core issue, and fix it. In the case of metabolic function, food is our drug.
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