This is the divide covered in the Ultra-processed People book. We can eat real cheese, though not to excess. But we can't really eat all that other stuff without consequences.

Yet, I would say that people who eat a lot of this manufactured food thinks it is cheese. But processed concoctions are what covers their nachos, cheesesteak subs, and au gratin potatoes.

Often, this makes a bad thing worse. But real cheese is far more satisfying, in lower quantities. They don't know what they are missing. And some of it would be a healthy part of the meal, instead of plastic that will give them problems.

Also, I see a LOT of added sugar and wheat, even in things that have no business in the recipe. Because, I'm sure, they know of these substances having tasty & addictive properties.

This was the author's distinction in the book. When he moved to homecooked, even things like lasagna became something the family could incorporate. It was part of how he lost the weight, and has been keeping it off.

Processed cheese is such a good example of the difference.

Yes, processed cheese! and forever to my regret, the Blue Box Kraft macaroni and cheese I gave to my DD when she refused whatever real food was on offer.
I like this list…simple, straightforward what NOT to buy, though would be better with some options to replace the UPF.

Ps, FoodBabe is the US was after Kraft for years because they had 2 artificial dyes in the US version of Mac n cheese that were not in the UK version. Now I'm seeing side by side comparisons of ingredients in cereals and other UPF..sometimes the list in US is double the length. The UK/Europe ban a number of additives we throw in for no good reason (likely cheaper and sweeter) whatever…the US versions may be even worse.

https://foodbabe.com/food-in-americ...t-so-different/

In the book, the author described getting a takeaway meal with only the ingredients he or his wife would have used. And I was amazed! I have never seen that.

However, our biggest local supermarket has brought in more takeaway meals in their deli counter that have been improved. Which is cheering news.

I think groceries should offer such "homecooked" meals as the author enjoyed in the UK. The problem isn't who cooked it. It's what they put in it.

The problem is, where do we draw the line between processed and ultra processed.

Cheese and butter are processed cream.

Corn, broccoli, cauliflower, and so many others have been processed through the years by selective breeding.

Squash and strain tomatoes, add some herbs and spices, and you end up with processed tomato sauce.

On the other end of the spectrum we have Twinkies, Pop Tarts, and others.

Somewhere in between is a good line not to cross often. But exactly where is that? I suppose it's different for different folks.

I'm fairly strict about it, which is probably why I'm 65lbs or so down for so many decades.

Dr Van Tulken's definition in post #1 and explained in his book is clear enough for me.


Real cheese and butter are not UPF…Processed cheese food is. If the tomato sauce is only tomatoes and herbs it is not UPF, but with added starches or gums, it is.

Demi, the cartoon, I’m stealing it.

I made the points to show both extremes.



All food in the grocery store is there for big business profit.

That limits almost anything. My table salt has iodine in it (low extreme). I don't salt my food much.

I suppose the fresh fruit and veggies have been coated with something that isn't in a home kitchen to give them longer shelf life.

If your beef isn't organic, you are getting a lot of ingredients not found in your kitchen. Same for pork, fowl, veggies, and so on.

My thinking is that if you asked 10 different specialists where to draw the line between processed and ultra processed foods, you'd probably get 9 different answers.

And what makes Chris an expert? I don't mean to dis him, but looking him up on Wiki shows me that the brothers are more media people than practicing doctors. Of course that doesn't mean they are wrong.

What I'm trying to get out, is that there are no hard and fast borders to anything we eat. The proverb “One man's meat is another man's poison” comes to mind.

I for one, limit my consumption of processed foods, sugars, and starches. It is what works for me, and my health record is testament to that (one cold every 15 years, can't remember the last time I had any other illness, and I'm on zero prescription medications). But we are all different, it might not work for the next.

My advice (for what it's worth — I'm no expert) is that if you are going to read a book, read a dozen. Investigate each author for their experience and credentials, then try a few things until you find out what works for you. When trying different diets, refer to your doctor, who can prescribe blood tests and examine you to see how you are doing.

I wouldn't pick one author, even if he/she calls himself/herself a doctor and blindly follow his/her instructions.

Of course YMMV.

Bob

You're right that there are no hard and fast rules for what makes something ULTRA processed.

You could technically call something like home-made mashed cauliflower an ultra processed food.

Hear me out on this: I buy the cauliflower, the butter, the cream cheese (some people use sour cream), salt, granulated garlic and onion powder.

The * in the following list of ingredients indicates every time some ingredient used to make homemade mashed cauliflower goes through a process that can result in that ingredient being considered an ultra processed food.

Unless the cauliflower is in season locally, it's been raised in some other part of the country - unless you live in an area that it never gets too warm for cauliflower to grow year round, it's been shipped, and shipping long distances* automatically signals that it could be ultra processed.

If it's fresh cauliflower, it's been harvested and packaged in plastic* to help protect it in shipment (of course it also has a brand name* and bar code or PLU code on that plastic packaging).

If frozen, it's been blanched* in a factory* to shut down the enzymes* that cause loss of flavor and color. Then it's chilled*, frozen*, packaged in plastic* with the brand name* on it, and shipped out to various locations around the country.


The dairy products all start with milking a cow, but then unless the milk has been certified safe as raw milk, it's been pasteurized*. From there, the milk is processed in a factory*: cream is then skimmed off to make the cream cheese or sour cream, as well as the butter.

The cream cheese is cultured, and has stabilizers and thickeners added to it. It's then packaged in foil or plastic* wrapping, and then in a box with a brand name* on it.

Sour cream is cultured in a factory*, and packaged in a plastic* container with a brand name* on it.

In a factory*, the butter is churned, washed, salted/left unsalted, formed* into sticks, wrapped in paper, and then packaged in a box with a brand name* on it.

Salt: depending on what kind you're using, it's been mined (regular salt, or naturally occurring colored salts) or using factory* processes had moisture removed from it (sea salt), may have had iodine added* to it, packaged in a factory* in a cardboard box, plastic bag* or bottle with a brand name* on it.

Granulated garlic and onion powder: both started as root vegetables. Both are then put through multiple factory* processing steps (such as sterilizing, chopping, dehydrating, grinding), ultimately resulting in a concentrated* and refined* (no skins) form of the original food. Then they're packaged in plastic* or glass bottles with labels* on them.

After I've steamed the cauliflower tender, I add all those processed ingredients (cream cheese, butter, salt, onion powder and granulated garlic), and use a stick blender to further process it into a smooth, seasoned mixture. (I then put the mashed cauliflower in a container for storage in the fridge, because there's no way I can eat all of it at one sitting)

Between all the processed and ultra-processed ingredients used in it, and the additional processing in my kitchen, it could easily be considered an ultra-processed food.


But wait! Since I made it at home, it's not considered to be an ultra processed food, because making it at home causes the taint of ultra-processing to be miraculously wiped away! (just like how homemade cookies are not ultra processed, purely because they're made AT HOME from the same ingredients as the ultra-processed packaged cookies bought from the store.)

It was many years ago I heard Nina Teicholz describe the tendency of our captured organizations to point to various bogeyman entities to divert attention away from carbs and vegetable seed oils. We all know the list: cholesterol, saturated fat, red meat, salt, simple sugars, overeating, lack of exercise, what time and how often you eat, etc. I suspect that is what is going on with UPF.

I had to (metaphorically) go to Canada to get this list:

View Ingredients and Allergens
Big Mac Bun
Ingredients: Enriched wheat flour, Water, Sugars (sugar, corn dextrose, corn maltodextrin), Yeast, Vegetable oil (canola and/or soy), Vegetable protein (pea, potato, faba bean), Sunflower oil, Corn starch, Sesame seeds, Salt, May contain any or all in varying proportions: Wheat gluten, Potato starch, Dough conditioners (DATEM, ascorbic acid, enzymes), Natural flavour, Corn starch, Vinegar.

Contains: Sesame seeds, Wheat.
Beef Patty
Ingredients: 100% pure beef.

Lettuce
Ingredients: Shredded iceberg lettuce.

Big Mac Sauce
Ingredients: Soybean oil, Sweet relish (sugars [sugar, glucose-fructose, glucose syrup], cucumber, water, vinegar, salt, xanthan gum, natural flavours, calcium chloride), Water, Vinegar, Liquid egg yolk, Onion powder, Spices (including mustard), Salt, Sugar, Garlic powder, Extractives of Paprika, Propylene glycol alginate, Caramel colour, Hydrolyzed (corn, soy, wheat) proteins.

Contains: Soy, Wheat, Egg, Mustard.
Processed Cheese Slice
Ingredients: Cheese (milk, modified milk ingredients, salt, bacterial culture, calcium chloride, microbial enzyme, lipase, annatto), Modified milk ingredients, Water, Sodium citrate, Salt, Citric acid, Beta-carotene, Paprika, Soy lecithin.

Contains: Soy, Milk.
Onions (dehydrated)
Ingredients: 100% onions.

Pickle Slices
Ingredients: Cucumbers, Water, Distilled vinegar, Salt, Calcium chloride, Potassium sorbate (preservative), Aluminum sulphate, Natural flavour (plant source), Polysorbate 80, Extractives of tumeric (colour).

Grill Seasoning
Ingredients: Salt, Spice (pepper), Sunflower oil (used as a processing aid).

Where I've bolded everything problematic.

Click this link for the US version

In the US, high fructose corn syrup is 55% fructose. In Canada, it's "only" 50% fructose, therefore called glucose-fructose ... as if somehow that makes it less awful

US high fructose corn syrup being 55% fructose probably started off as a 'health' claim. In the 1990s fructose was glorified as being healthier because it is found in fruit and doesn't raise BG. Only later was it discovered to go to the liver and cause metabolic havoc there.

Regular sugar is also 50% fructose and 50% glucose.

What a 50/50 high fructose corn syrup achieves is imitating the glucose/fructose proportions of cane sugar. That way it's no better or worse than real sugar.

The fact that it's liquid instead of granulated achieves the same cooking goal as the 55/45 high fructose corn syrup: as a liquid, it mixes into liquid or semi-liquid mixtures more easily than granulated sugar.


ETA: Sorry - I had accidentally quoted the wrong post!

Canadians still win the nutritrient reveal: In the US, they will give you pictures of the ingredients, and you will feel better about eating a Big Mac.

Though we shouldn't.