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  #76   ^
Old Mon, Dec-08-08, 18:59
Wifezilla's Avatar
Wifezilla Wifezilla is offline
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Plan: I'm a Barry Girl
Stats: 250/208/190 Female 72
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Location: Colorado
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Yes...you all need to stop eating red meat (then there will be more for me!!! Bwaa haa haaa!)
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  #77   ^
Old Mon, Dec-08-08, 19:50
BoBoGuy's Avatar
BoBoGuy BoBoGuy is offline
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Posts: 1,178
 
Plan: Low Carb - High Nutrition
Stats: 213/175/175 Male 72 Inches
BF: Belly Fat? Yes!
Progress: 100%
Location: California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wifezilla
Yes...you all need to stop eating red meat (then there will be more for me!!! Bwaa haa haaa!)

Are you sure??

Perhaps the 51 minute lecture below on primate evolution and human disease will change your opinion on the subject of red meat consumption?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vd9BZajbWY0

I accept in advance the possibly that you, nor few, if any will view it in it’s entirety.

Bo

Last edited by BoBoGuy : Tue, Dec-09-08 at 14:37. Reason: typo
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  #78   ^
Old Tue, Dec-09-08, 19:13
2bthinner!'s Avatar
2bthinner! 2bthinner! is offline
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Posts: 3,371
 
Plan: Intermittent Fasting, LC
Stats: 242/215/130 Female 5'7.5"
BF:too/dang/much
Progress: 24%
Location: Florida
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I had a relative once who had a tumor that had hair and teeth in it. I'm really not so sure the contents of a tumor is necessarily relevant..

I also wonder if any issues with red meat is more related to the hormones and antibiotics that many of them get.

I know my horse wormer says not to use it on animals destined to be food.

It seems to me though, that if we weren't supposed to eat it, it wouldn't taste good.

PS: Did you notice at :06 it says Kirin and Pharma present?

Last edited by 2bthinner! : Tue, Dec-09-08 at 19:20.
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  #79   ^
Old Tue, Dec-09-08, 19:28
2bthinner!'s Avatar
2bthinner! 2bthinner! is offline
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Posts: 3,371
 
Plan: Intermittent Fasting, LC
Stats: 242/215/130 Female 5'7.5"
BF:too/dang/much
Progress: 24%
Location: Florida
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Check out this youtube. This kittie likes broccoli...
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  #80   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 01:23
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Wolflady Wolflady is offline
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Posts: 56
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 186/176/158 Female 172cm
BF:
Progress: 36%
Location: The Netherlands
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 2bthinner!
Check out this youtube. This kittie likes broccoli...


This one? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQi3...heezburger.com/
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  #81   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 12:24
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
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That was so funny! It's weird how animals can get obsessed over foods they don't normally eat. My cat used to do that with cashews, only not quite so grumpy when I would take them away as that little kitty with the broccoli.
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  #82   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 13:26
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Demokat Demokat is offline
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Posts: 1,301
 
Plan: Paleo/Organic Fat Flush
Stats: 193/176/145 Female 5'4.5"
BF:42/31/24
Progress: 35%
Location: Boston
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nancy LC
That was so funny! It's weird how animals can get obsessed over foods they don't normally eat. My cat used to do that with cashews, only not quite so grumpy when I would take them away as that little kitty with the broccoli.


One of my kitties (Reno) used to lick the salt on almonds. He would never eat a nut-I've heard they're poisonous for cats-but he would lick the salt off the nuts. I discovered this when I left a bowl unattended once and watched him take one out of the bowl with his paw and lick it. He ignored unsalted pecans so I knew it was the salt that was the attraction. Cats are funny.
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  #83   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 14:56
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BoBoGuy BoBoGuy is offline
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Plan: Low Carb - High Nutrition
Stats: 213/175/175 Male 72 Inches
BF: Belly Fat? Yes!
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Humans have been eating meat for millions of years, and there has never been an entirely vegetarian culture (though there have been cultures that only eat meat). Our closest relatives, chimps, eat a small percentage of meat. Our physiology marks us as omnivores in multiple ways: our teeth and our intestines both look more like other omnivores than they look like either carnivores or herbivores. However, none of this means that we need to eat meat. We are omnivores because during the millions of years that we were hunter-gatherers, we found it to our advantage to be able to eat meat when the opportunity arose (having a wider selection of foods to choose from increases survivability). So those with a greater ability to digest meat had a higher chance of survival, and the traits that enable meat digestion (and skill at hunting, etc.) spread through the population. All this means is that we have evolved the ability to eat meat, not the need to eat meat. Being omnivores it did, once upon a time, make it easier for us to survive.

Ignore the assumption that hunter-gatherers of the past ate lots of meat, and look at the actual data from anthropologists. Hunter-gatherers typically eat a diet that is 80% or more plant matter. Early anthropologists studying hunter-gatherers assumed that meat is more important than it is because they spent most of their time with the men, and the men liked to talk about hunting. But in fact, meat is a small percentage of overall diet in most hunter-gatherer societies (excluding cultures like the Inuit where meat is the only food available). A real Paleo diet would consist largely of whole grains, nuts, vegetables, fruit, and leaves, and would include a smaller percentage of mammal meat, bird meat, seafood, insects, and eggs. It would include no dairy at all, and would be very high in fiber and nutrients and come from a much wider variety of plants than we eat in our society. Remember that the human body is very adaptable and this is only a generalization; humans can subsist on many different diets without severe health effects.

(American Museum of Natural History)
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  #84   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 15:06
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girlbug2 girlbug2 is offline
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Plan: Ketogenic paleo
Stats: 186/167/125 Female 5'4"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BoBoGuy
A real Paleo diet would consist largely of whole grains, nuts, vegetables, fruit, and leaves, and would include a smaller percentage of mammal meat, bird meat, seafood, insects, and eggs. It would include no dairy at all, and would be very high in fiber and nutrients and come from a much wider variety of plants than we eat in our society. Remember that the human body is very adaptable and this is only a generalization; humans can subsist on many different diets without severe health effects.

(American Museum of Natural History)


Not true about the grains -- remember the "naked with a sharp stick" rule; if you can't obtain it and eat it whilst naked, using only a sharp stick for a tool, it's technology-dependant. Our Neanderthal ancestors lived that way, not having the technology to cook their food or process grains, which require both processing and cooking. Dont' make the mistake of confusing "caveman" diets with the diets of latter hunter-gatherers that posessed access to more technology.
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  #85   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 15:18
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ReginaW ReginaW is offline
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Posts: 2,759
 
Plan: Atkins/Controlled Carb
Stats: 275/190/190 Female 72
BF:Not a clue!
Progress: 100%
Location: Missouri
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Quote:
Ignore the assumption that hunter-gatherers of the past ate lots of meat, and look at the actual data from anthropologists. Hunter-gatherers typically eat a diet that is 80% or more plant matter. Early anthropologists studying hunter-gatherers assumed that meat is more important than it is because they spent most of their time with the men, and the men liked to talk about hunting. But in fact, meat is a small percentage of overall diet in most hunter-gatherer societies (excluding cultures like the Inuit where meat is the only food available). A real Paleo diet would consist largely of whole grains, nuts, vegetables, fruit, and leaves, and would include a smaller percentage of mammal meat, bird meat, seafood, insects, and eggs. It would include no dairy at all, and would be very high in fiber and nutrients and come from a much wider variety of plants than we eat in our society. Remember that the human body is very adaptable and this is only a generalization; humans can subsist on many different diets without severe health effects.


80% of calories from plants?

Imagine the wheelbarrow each of our ancestors needed to gather and haul 2400+ calories a day from plant-based foods if needing 3000-calories a day!

And how, pray tell, did they gather that much plant-based food for each person during the ice age we managed to survive through?

Edited to add: Where exactly are the cave painting depicting all this plant-food abundance? The painting all depict animals, hunted animals, quite tasty critters for food....but not these oh so important - 80% of their calories - plants!
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  #86   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 16:02
Wifezilla's Avatar
Wifezilla Wifezilla is offline
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Plan: I'm a Barry Girl
Stats: 250/208/190 Female 72
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Quote:
how, pray tell, did they gather that much plant-based food for each person during the ice age we managed to survive through?


They didn't. That only existed in a vegan wet-dream.
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  #87   ^
Old Wed, Dec-10-08, 18:56
2bthinner!'s Avatar
2bthinner! 2bthinner! is offline
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Posts: 3,371
 
Plan: Intermittent Fasting, LC
Stats: 242/215/130 Female 5'7.5"
BF:too/dang/much
Progress: 24%
Location: Florida
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Um, having eaten many a blackberry and oranges in my day, there isn't enough plant vegetation conveniently available. Not without intentionally cultivating it. A large animal, dried, much more fits the bill. Unless we all ate grass. THAT is very available.


What's in your backyard? I still have lots of blackberry bushes and a couple of blueberry bushes. I have a grapefruit tree growing. But, it won't bear fruit for at least five years. Otherwise, I have pine and oak trees. I do have mock cherry trees, but you can't eat those. And grass and moss. We cleared this lot, it had grown wild for a number of years. I did have some passion plants show up in my pasture. Not enough to live on.

Quote:
much wider variety of plants
Maybe it's just Florida, but there ain't a wide variety of plants here. ie, wild, edible. There's LOTS of ornamental plants.

Edit again. And prickly pear. I've eaten a number of those too! I have a couple in my yard.

Edit again: I would also assume the fruit eating was seasonal. My grandmother had an orange grove. You only had fruit certain times of the year. And I don't think paleo man could can his fruit.

Vegetarian: Indian word for bad hunter....(I need to get this tee shirt!)

Last edited by 2bthinner! : Wed, Dec-10-08 at 19:07.
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  #88   ^
Old Thu, Dec-11-08, 11:54
Rachel1 Rachel1 is offline
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Plan: Atkins/IF
Stats: 12/06/04 Female 5' 1.5
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Location: Vancouver BC, Canada
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I can't speak for anywhere else on the planet, but I know that here on Canada's west coast, there is not a lot in the way of edible plant foods, and of course they are seasonal. Many of the plant foods consumed by the aboriginal population require processing - pounding, soaking, cooking, etc - to be edible, and of those, many can be eaten only in small quantities. Animal-based foods were certainly the norm here, for as long as people have been living in this part of the world. I imagine other non-tropical areas aren't a whole lot different.

Rachel
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  #89   ^
Old Thu, Dec-11-08, 14:25
BoBoGuy's Avatar
BoBoGuy BoBoGuy is offline
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Plan: Low Carb - High Nutrition
Stats: 213/175/175 Male 72 Inches
BF: Belly Fat? Yes!
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Location: California
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TheCaveman
There is no known combination of plants available in the regions and climates where humans evolved that would allow enough humans to eat year round to maintain viable reproducing groups.

It seems the hominids at Gran Dolina had a solution to the problem you’ve mentioned above.

A close look at the fossils found at Gran Dolina from 800,000 years ago reveals a startling story: these hominids were butchered by other hominids. Both the human and animal bones have similar markings on them that could only have been made by stone tools. Using this evidence, the researchers who discovered these fossils argue that these hominids not only ate other mammals but also other humans.

The hominid remains were jumbled together with several thousand bone fragments from other mammals. Many of the bones—human and nonhuman alike—have marks that could only have resulted from being chopped and scraped with stone tools. Scientists working at the site suggest that the way in which the bones were cut, twisted and broken indicates that both the meat and bone marrow were eaten.

Modern humans have practiced cannibalism—but only very rarely. Researchers have no way of knowing why the early humans at Gran Dolina ate others of their kind. A rich diversity of animals lived at Atapuerca during this period, so the hominids probably did not lack food and turn to cannibalism to meet their nutritional needs. Instead, the cannibalism seems to have taken place over a long period during which the hominids of Gran Dolina made human flesh a regular part of their diet.
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  #90   ^
Old Thu, Dec-11-08, 14:55
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
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Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 72%
Location: San Diego, CA
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No surprise. Chimps eat other chimps. I think they probably don't prey on their own tribes though, they look to outsiders.
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