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  #1   ^
Old Mon, Nov-19-07, 09:59
Iluvgreys's Avatar
Iluvgreys Iluvgreys is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 180/137/125 Female 5 feet 2 inches
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: St. Louis
Default When do I eat carbs for workouts....

and still lose fat?

I have been working out for 2 months now "trying" to do Atkins. My mood and energy level have been unstable. I don't think I have carbs at the right time. My schedule is this:

Sunday-Weights-one hour at the gym doing abs, arms, legs alternately on the machines Monday-45-60 min. spin class (Very intense)
Tues-weights
Wed-spin
Thurs weights
Friday-day off
Sat. spin

Sometimes my schedule changes a bit due to my kids and other obligations. Sometimes I only get 2 days of weights in (always thought cardio was better at burning fat)

I weigh about 135 and I haven't lost anything in 2 months (gained muscle?) My clothes fit better so I know am losing fat.

When exactly do eat carbs? What kind are best? How much and how far before a workout? I try to eat 30 or less total carbs but I have been sneaking in low carb tortillas. Sometime I am so sluggish durning a workout and I feel horrible. How can I time this all to feel great, have energy, and burn the most fat? Or is there a book I should read to help? Thanks so much for your help! Since working out I have been so confused on my carb intake!
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  #2   ^
Old Mon, Nov-19-07, 10:19
Gostrydr Gostrydr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,175
 
Plan: close to zero carbs
Stats: 225/206/210 Male 73
BF:
Progress:
Default

Cardio is not better at burning fat...You need to build muscle to boost metabolism and the way to do that is to lift weights..
You are only taking one day off a week for rest. That is not ideal. Try to workout, at the most 5 days a week..at the most, 4 would be ideal .

Dump the scale..go by how your clothes are fitting you and what you see in the mirror.

I for one do not like starchy or simple carbs for workouts especially if one is at a higher bodyfat%..I like Glutamine with whey for post workout nutrition and a whey shake or BCAA'S before.

Of course we are all different, you may need some carbs, but in my experience they seem to hamper performance and blunt lipolysis.

Try this for carbs..every 3 days have a carb only meal consititing of a dry yam or a potatoe,bowl of brown rice, a healthy pasta or a bowl of steel cut oats..not protein or fat is too be eaten with this meal..this should help you replace glycogen and help you feel a little better as you workout.

How is your fat intake? Are you eating a lowfat version of Atkins..chicken breast,fish,turkey, egg whites...that kindof faire?
If so. may I suggest you up your fat with some egg yolks,butter,coconut oil and nice juicy steaks or hamburger patties.

Your body may still be adjusting to not using glucose as its primary energy source, so I would give it a little more time..adding carbs in may just be putting a bandaid on your current dilemna.
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  #3   ^
Old Mon, Nov-19-07, 10:20
kaypeeoh kaypeeoh is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 1,216
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 185/180/165
BF:
Progress: 25%
Default

Just my opinion, but unless you are elevating your heart rate substantially you don't need carbs. You are burning a mixture of carbs and fat whever you exercise. But the mixture shifts toward mostly carb-burning the faster your heart rate.

If I understand Taubes, by burning off the carbs the body begins to release fat for energy use. So you have to work out hard enough to get rid of the carbs in the blood then be careful about not replenishing the carbs after the workout.

Simple carbs get into the bloodstream within minutes so I keep Hammergel on hand if I find I'm not running well. The Hammergel gets burned off and I'm still not producing a lot of insulin.

Like I said, just my opinion.
Generally I skip breakfast. Taubes says at that point the insulin levels are low and I'm beginning to release fatty acids. By noon I should be burning fat when I go for my workout. I can run but at a slower rate than if I'd ingested carbs that morning.
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  #4   ^
Old Mon, Nov-19-07, 13:22
Iluvgreys's Avatar
Iluvgreys Iluvgreys is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 180/137/125 Female 5 feet 2 inches
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: St. Louis
Default

I eat lots of fat! Low fat just didn't cut it for me.

My heart rate goes in the 160's at times durning spin class.

Can I stay at 20 and under for carb amount and still work out like I do?

My trainer put this workout together for me and told me to just take 1 day off. Why is only one day a problem? I would LOVE to take more days off LOL!

What is cardio good for if not burning fat? Man, I work so hard durning spin class! I know some of it works on strength when I put on the tension. I guess if I have to skip something it should be my spin class?

Thanks sooo much for your help!!!
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  #5   ^
Old Mon, Nov-19-07, 13:29
Wifezilla's Avatar
Wifezilla Wifezilla is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,367
 
Plan: I'm a Barry Girl
Stats: 250/208/190 Female 72
BF:
Progress: 70%
Location: Colorado
Default

I would try the lower carbs and see how you feel.

Quote:
What is cardio good for if not burning fat?

Stamina?
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  #6   ^
Old Mon, Nov-19-07, 16:46
JL53563's Avatar
JL53563 JL53563 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,209
 
Plan: The Real Human Diet
Stats: 225/165/180 Male 5'8"
BF:?/?/8.6%
Progress: 133%
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Default

Quote:
When do I eat carbs for workouts....

Never, works good for me. I keep my carbs below 20....and usually around 5-10 per day. I have great workouts. Low carbers who complain of not having energy for workouts are probably eating too many carbs to let their bodies become fat and keto-adapted, or have not given it enough time. I do think that cardio can work for burning fat, but it needs to be intense, as in HIIT. You need to get your heart rate up to at least 90% of max.
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  #7   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 09:45
Gostrydr Gostrydr is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,175
 
Plan: close to zero carbs
Stats: 225/206/210 Male 73
BF:
Progress:
Default

Iluvgreys..one day for recuperation is not ideal...You grow and improve on recovery days, not the days you work out, so shorten it up and give yourself another day or 2 of rest.

Do you pay your trainer for all of these days?? If so that may be the issue, the more days you train the more moolah they make.

Forget "heart rate and the fat burning zone" and all of that malarkey. Embrace Excercise Post Oxygen Consumption(EPOC).

EPOC is based on how much fat you burn HOURS after your workout, not during.

So keeping EPOC in mind, studies have shown that, aerobics, long steady state cardio(like your spin class) will help the body burn fat for four hours after you work out.

Well if you did a HIIT(high intensity interval training) your body would burn fat for 38 hours AFTER your workout!!

And HIIT takes a lot less time..you work up to 15- 20 minutes tops 2-3 days a week.

Barely an hour and better results.

So if I may, drop the spin class, increase the days you lift weights and decrease the days you workout..

and keep on low carbing
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  #8   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 10:35
Iluvgreys's Avatar
Iluvgreys Iluvgreys is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 180/137/125 Female 5 feet 2 inches
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: St. Louis
Default

Thanks for the info!

I am confused about spin class. To me it is HIIT. We "race" or stand and recover over and over. It really is interval training IMO. Maybe I am wrong but it is extremely intense and then we get to recover. I have NEVER worked so hard in my life LOL! It is the best workout I have ever had. So wouldn't that be HIIT?

I only paid a trainer for 2 sessions and she put together a workout based on my needs (I am a teacher and bend over many desks during the day...) I have been on my own ever since..increasing weight as I feel I can.
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  #9   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 13:31
JL53563's Avatar
JL53563 JL53563 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,209
 
Plan: The Real Human Diet
Stats: 225/165/180 Male 5'8"
BF:?/?/8.6%
Progress: 133%
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvgreys
Thanks for the info!

I am confused about spin class. To me it is HIIT. We "race" or stand and recover over and over. It really is interval training IMO. Maybe I am wrong but it is extremely intense and then we get to recover. I have NEVER worked so hard in my life LOL! It is the best workout I have ever had. So wouldn't that be HIIT?

I only paid a trainer for 2 sessions and she put together a workout based on my needs (I am a teacher and bend over many desks during the day...) I have been on my own ever since..increasing weight as I feel I can.


It does sound like HIIT, but some would argue that if you can do it for an hour, then it's not intense enough.
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  #10   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 13:35
Sweet Tart Sweet Tart is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 23
 
Plan: Nutritional Ketosis
Stats: 257/155/145 Female 5'6"
BF:
Progress: 91%
Location: Maui
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JL53563
It does sound like HIIT, but some would argue that if you can do it for an hour, then it's not intense enough.

LOL - I was thinking the same thing. True HIIT usually leaves you trashed after 20-30 minutes. If you know that you have to go for an hour, you usually don't go all out because you know you have to leave something in the tank for that last 1/2 hour.
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  #11   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 14:40
kbfunTH's Avatar
kbfunTH kbfunTH is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,240
 
Plan: UDS
Stats: 199/190/190 Male 69
BF:12%/11%/6%
Progress: 100%
Location: Pflugerville, TX
Default

I'm going against the grain here, but this is what I would do. I'd up the carbs to about 50/day, keep the spinning and workouts the way you like, be careful not to train to failure too often and cut back on your daily calorie intake slightly. You'll have the energy you want, your moods will get better, you'll feel better and you won't have to worry about the timing, or type of carbs so much.

You may not stay in ketosis as often, but you don't need to be to stay fat adapted. Give yourself a couple of weeks and see what happens.

Be ready, soon you'll hit another maintenance level and you'll need to make another adjustment. The lower your weight gets, the harder it becomes.
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  #12   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 18:27
Sweet Tart Sweet Tart is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 23
 
Plan: Nutritional Ketosis
Stats: 257/155/145 Female 5'6"
BF:
Progress: 91%
Location: Maui
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvgreys
When exactly do eat carbs? What kind are best? How much and how far before a workout? I try to eat 30 or less total carbs but I have been sneaking in low carb tortillas. Sometime I am so sluggish durning a workout and I feel horrible. How can I time this all to feel great, have energy, and burn the most fat? Or is there a book I should read to help? Thanks so much for your help! Since working out I have been so confused on my carb intake!


I think that the TNT (targeted Nutrition Tactics) Diet book is a great reference for low carbing it and working out. The authors cover working out while following LC, pre and post workout nutrition, and carbohydrate timing. You can pick and choose between different plans depending on your goals. The book also has a great 8 week workout plan .
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  #13   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 20:00
Iluvgreys's Avatar
Iluvgreys Iluvgreys is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 180/137/125 Female 5 feet 2 inches
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: St. Louis
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sweet Tart
LOL - I was thinking the same thing. True HIIT usually leaves you trashed after 20-30 minutes. If you know that you have to go for an hour, you usually don't go all out because you know you have to leave something in the tank for that last 1/2 hour.


Well truely it is 60 minutes with warm up and cool down and stretch in there. 40-45 min. of actual intervals. Maybe there is too much recovery time inbetween? Would that make a differerence? I know I give everything I have and force myself to get through that last 10 min or so.
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  #14   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 20:15
JL53563's Avatar
JL53563 JL53563 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,209
 
Plan: The Real Human Diet
Stats: 225/165/180 Male 5'8"
BF:?/?/8.6%
Progress: 133%
Location: Wisconsin, USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Iluvgreys
Well truely it is 60 minutes with warm up and cool down and stretch in there. 40-45 min. of actual intervals. Maybe there is too much recovery time inbetween? Would that make a differerence? I know I give everything I have and force myself to get through that last 10 min or so.

It could be that your recovery times are too long. How long are your "hard" intervals, and how long are your recoveries?
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  #15   ^
Old Tue, Nov-20-07, 23:50
Ghoulia's Avatar
Ghoulia Ghoulia is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,214
 
Plan: Moderate Low-Carb <100g
Stats: 130/110.2/115 Female 5'3.5
BF:00/00/00
Progress: 132%
Location: Cal-i-forn-ia
Default

When I do HIIT on the treadmill, I can only manage about 8 sprints, at 10mph, for 20 seconds, with one minute between them.

Then I do a little steady state (4mph ~ 4% grade) for 10 minutes or less and go home.

Sounds like you're really doing a lot of volume.

Coming from a complete and utter former cardio queen - it took me a LONG LONG TIME to wrap my head around only 20 or 30 minutes of cardio after lifting (HIIT only 2wice a week, the rest steady state or hills) until I started taking measurements.

The tape measurer doesn't lie. I've lost a pile of inches and I attribute that to my weightlifting.

If I would have started it a year ago instead of 3 months ago? I woulda been looking hella good in HALF the time.

I continually kick myself in the ass for thinking cardio was the end all be all. Sure, sure, it's great for your heart and other things, but one doesn't need to go balls out all the time to benefit from it.

I still don't believe it, but the tape measurer tells me differently!

I agree with Gostrydr 100%, as I'm living proof.

Julia
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