I have seen this over and over again but I cannot validate whether or not it actually happened... Anybody out there know (can validate) if this really happened?

When Dr Atkins was called before a Senate committee headed by George McGovern, he was forced to admit that pregnant women following his low carb diet would suffer fetal damage to their unborn babies.

"There’s one other point I’m very sorry about," Atkins finally admitted, "I now understand that ketosis during pregnancy could result in fetal damage. My pregnant patients have never had this problem, but I realize I didn’t study enough cases to validate my recommendation. If anyone wants a retraction, I’ll be glad to give one."

Every reference I find for that comes back to the PCRM and Dr Neal Barnard... PETA fronts who want to try to smear low-carb wherever they can. They also hate the March of Dimes, so I really doubt anything they come up with has much validity.

The jury is still out on whether ketosis is safe for anyone at any time. I'm settled in my mind on the safety of it, however, for everyone.

I know that this thread was not started toward me, but your last post implied to me that I had not used caution when I was pregnant. And that's what made mad.

The traditional Inuit had to have been in Ketosis for tens of thousands of years. If their babies were not healthy, they would have ceased existence long ago.

I feel like no matter what I post here, that there will be those out there who will negate it. (after all, I am on a low carb forum) ;-). I believe that the argument that is based on the theory, that the human race has had millions of years of low carb induced ketosis with safe pregnancies, is not valid. Most humans have to consume less than 20 grams of carbs per day to enter into this state of ketosis. Certainly before there were processed foods, people took in carbs in the form of fruit, vegetables, grains, dairy and berries and most likely they consumed more than 20 grams of carbs per day. That being said, I have no problem with the maintenance level of Atkins while pregnant. I was on the maintenance level while pregnant.

I do have a problem with advising people that Induction levels of carbohydrates are safe during pregnancy. I have no problem with anyone personally and I am not out to offend but I think that this is a very important topic considering what is at stake. There are people out there reading these threads and making choices and I obviously feel strongly that any attempt to lose weight while pregnant is not a good idea and that it should be avoided at all cost.

Any information that I post here can be twisted into what the reader wants to conclude but at least it is here so that people can make a decision based on different view points.

I have to admit, I'm with you on not recommending Atkins Induction during pregnancy. I just would not feel comfortable doing it myself. *Maybe* OWL or Pre-Maintenance for someone who is considerably overweight. Even then, with the beginning of OWL, that's still just 25-30 carbs per day, so it doesn't seem like a very far departure from strict Induction. I just can't imagine trying to stay under 20 carbs daily while pregnant.

Certainly this is another area where YMMV. My doc during my second pregnancy advised me that I should only gain about 10 pounds during the entire nine months because I was already so heavy. He didn't have much advice on how not to "over-gain" or whatever though. Perhaps following OWL or Pre-Maintenance Atkins would have done it for me.

You know, the other part of this equation is: is ketosis safe while breastfeeding? I started back on low-carb when my youngest was just two months old, and I was almost exclusively breastfeeding. Why? Because ketones are naturally present in breastmilk. My kids have been "eating" low-carb longer than I have! LOL And believe me, since this was the only baby I nursed while low-carbing, I watched his numbers more closely than my own. Now, a year later, I have the healthiest, happiest little man, and I weigh seventy pounds less.

I guess my point is, if the presence of ketones is expected - perhaps even desired - in breastmilk, why would ketosis (not brought on by starvation, obviously) be a bad thing during pregnancy??

I don't think anyone would argue that trying to lose weight while pregnant isn't wise. It was the blanket statements that ketones cause fetal damage that just went waaaayyyy to far into scare tactics that became ridiculous.

Some Inuit tribes had cultural taboos against eating any type of plant matter and ate meat and fat only. Others ate what was available seasonally. The fact still remains that those people that lived in climates with seasons did not have access to fruits, vegetables, etc...year round and, given that a typical pregnancy lasts 40 weeks, some of that time would have been spent at a fairly low carb level; low enough to have been producing ketones. Some of it may have been spent with periods of very little food at all if a woman spent all winter being pregnant. Ketosis can begin anywhere under 50-60 grams of carb, not at 20 or less.
As for losing weight while pregnant, while I wouldn't recommend it as a whole, my OB/GYN wasn't freaked out by the fact that I wound up 25 pounds less after delivery than before I became pregnant; in other words, I lost 25 pounds each time I was pregnant. Actually, I just kept my weight stable during each pregnancy and at the time, I was atually advised to keep my weight gain to 15 pounds or less which was still a net loss considering that baby, placenta and amniotic fluid account for 20-25 pounds. Turns out that maternal high blood sugars are worse for a fetus than mom losing a few pounds. Brain damage? Nope; honor roll students, both of 'em.
It might also be good to note that the presence of ketones is considered normal in most pregnancies, particularly later in the pregnancy. See this link and specifially this quote:

Lisa, that goes along with all of my reading. I was in ketosis during my pregnancy and my baby is perfect

I'm glad to hear the voice of reason-with some reaearch to back it up

ketosis does not equal fat loss

in fact breast milk is a ketogenic food-thats right. babies who are fed exclusively breast milk are in ketosis

This is a very personal question so obviously you don't have to answer ... but I am curious. What was the weeks gestation and weight of your babies?

I will give you mine because it wouldn't be fair not to...

41 weeks 9lbs 8 oz 21 inches
38 weeks 8lbs 10 oz 21 inches

I am not saying that this always indicates the health of a child. Much ado was made over the size of my babies and yet I was sternly told not to do the Atkins diet. They even induced me 17 days early for the second because an ultrasound indicated that he was macrosomic. I tested negative for Gestational Diabetes throughout both pregnancies and the babies sugar levels were normal at birth.

I should probably add that both of my children are still over the 97th percentile in both height and weight so I have attributed their size to genetics. Also of note... I gained 60lbs with the first and 80lbs with the second... even then I was told to watch sugar but sternly told not to go on a ketogenic diet.

Just wondering... not trying to offend.

Average birth weights in the US range from 7 lbs. 2 oz. to 7 lbs. 7 oz.
DD #1; 39 weeks. 7 lbs. 5 oz, 20 inches long
DD #2; 39 weeks (I was induced at that point because she kept wanting to be in tranverse presentation and they had already externally turned her once)
8 lbs, 6 oz. 21 inches long.

My oldest has been in the 95th percentile for height and weight since she was 2 weeks old.
My youngest has been around 15th percentile for height and around the 5th percentile for weight for most of her life even though she started out bigger than her sister.
My dd's are 11 months apart and even though I had a net 25 pound loss in each pregnancy, my babies were obviously getting the nutrients they needed to grow properly since they were average to above average size at birth .

I also have a friend who has morning sickness 24/7 the entire pregnancy and has 4 normal children (yeah...why she would put herself through that 4 times is way beyond me).

DS #1: 42 weeks, 10 lbs. 4 oz., 22"
DS #2: 41 weeks, 10 lbs. 14 oz., 22"
DS#3: 40 weeks, 10 lbs. 2 oz., 21"

My youngest is the only baby for whom I was at least attempting to watch carbs during pregnancy. I don't remember specifically, but I believe I gained the most during my first pregnancy. I too tested negative for gestational diabetes all three times, had normal blood pressure, etc., and all three boys were perfectly healthy. My oldest had a bit of jaundice at birth, but the other two had no problems whatsoever.

I find it so interesting that the experiences vary so greatly. I am not god, so I am in no position to judge people but as you can imagine after what I went through with weight gain and the very stern warnings against the ketogenic diet while pregnant, the idea of a "low carb" pregnancy was pretty horrifiying to me. Lets face it, if I thought it was safe, I would have done it and I assumed that everyone else out there had received the same warning. (which obviously is not true)

If somebody else out there has a dr that says to them... "That's safe." Who am I to say to them, that its not. I think that it is a good idea to note that these kinds of warnings are put out to ensure that the baby has the best chance at health not that they have a 100% chance of poor health if they are not followed. Another thing to note is that some health problems do not become apparent in people until the are adults.

Also, the way in which the ketogenic risk was explained to me was that its not exposure to ketones that causes the risk but the lack of carbohydrates for the baby during a very fast growth period. See, the baby gets its nutrition from the umbilical cord which comes from food that we eat. If we don't eat carbs then we get our required carbs from our ketones and the baby would have to draw their required carbs from the baby's own ketones. If the baby doesn't have fat stores to draw on, i think that we can see how this may be a problem. Again, its not that ketones harm the fetus, it is that if the ketones show up in our system, it is an indication that we are drawing from our fat reserves from either decreased carbohydates or not enough fuel/food in general. I had a friend who was hospitalized for this while pregnant and they put her on a glucose IV. She had severe morning sickness.

Nobody wants to hear that something that they did could potentially harm their child and I am certain that you are all wonderful loving parents but if what you are saying is true, then there are a lot of OBGYNs out there or at least where I am that are complete quacks. We are obviously in complete disagreement here and I think it is safe to say that a ketogenic diet is either a risk or its not so somebody in this argument is dealing with false information.

I had a friend who decided to not follow any of the other guidelines. She painted, put up drywall, ate tuna and soft cheese and had an occasional glass of wine with dinner. I was horrified. She thought I was nuts. Her first is healthy. The second, they are checking for autism but that could happen to anyone.

Ironically, she is dead set against the Atkins diet for anyone.