I honestly don't think anyone should be commenting on anyones willpower or lack thereof in these forums unless they have reached and maintained their goals. Even then, this subject is to be tread on most delicately as it's the very core or our issue. Most of us got here because we didn't have any to begin with. Now we're trying to learn better habits.

Like Anais Nin said, "We don't see things as they are, we see them as we are."

I go thru long spells where it doesn't bother me a bit and then.... the wrong combination of mental/emotional/physical and a non-plan food and BAM, I'm off plan.

Yes, I know it's me that chooses what I eat - I'm a grown up and I do the grocery shopping, nobody force feeds me and if I'm in a situation where I didn't choose the food (ie visiting out of town, etc) then I do the best that I can in that situation. Sometimes, when a person has an "issue", "addiction" whatever you might want to call it, it can get the better of them. If you happen to be somebody who doesn't have that issue, God bless ya and be grateful is all I can say. I wouldn't wish addiction of any kind on somebody else. I also wouldn't judge somebody else because they have an addiction that they are truly trying to overcome but are struggling. Sometimes it's a meandering, "scenic route" that we're taking on our journey to be healthy but at least we haven't turned back and gone home

Hi! My name is Judy and I'm a compulsive overeater!!

I am an OA'er who no longer attends 12 step meetings. I too, think that over eating compulsively is an eating disorder. I totally undertsand your problem with having the wrong/illegal foods in your home!! Its a tough one!!

Being that I live alone, I don't have the problem that you do!! My heart goes out to you!! I think that in time, you'll being to gain strength in ignoring all those foods. As you lose more weight, you'll begin to feel more empowered to ignore those foods and go to foods that you keep on hand at all times so that you can have your own legal snacks!!

If you've never attended an OA meeting, maybe now would be a good time for you to begin. I know that every person in that room would totally get what you are going through!!

I'll share one little anecdote: One in a while, I order in chinese food when I don't feel like cooking. I order a cup of chicken soup and tell them not to send me the fried noodles that go with it. They sent it anyway....another person would just throw them away!! I called the restaurant and yelled at them for not following my direction!! I had to have some so I ate a couple and had a hard time throwing them away. It spoiled my entire meal!! SEE? your not the only one who goes nuts with the wrong foods in your face!!

I'm sorry that you got so much flack in this thread for your problem. That was the last thing that you needed!!

((((Big Hug Craig!!)))) You can do this!! One day at a time!!

This is true. I don't know who said it, but I have always liked this one:

"Things just are...we supply the adjectives"

I'm sorry Kryssi but I disagree.

Sugar is not poison, anymore than olive oil is poison. Sugar is basically the refined raw carbohydrate energy, much like oils are refined raw fat energy. If a regular person eats too much sugar it's bad for you, just as if you eat too much oil it's bad for you. If you are carbohydrate sensitive and eat too much extra sugar then that is definitely very bad for you. The food really isn't POISON it's just that way for some people and some lifestyles.

I do occasionally have tiny bites of cake and small pieces of cookies and I like to think of myself as eating a low carb diet. Carbohydrate doesn't make up more than 25% of my DV calories. If that's not LC what is? .

Personally I don't like that extreme black or white mentality ... of blaming sugar, or saying NEVER to cookies/cakes. I understand trying to avoid sugar and cookies/cakes when practical (most of the time) because they're not very good for you, and I do this as well... but for me, that extreme mentality is just as toxic as the effects of overconsumption of sugar and junkfood itself. It is very well easier and HEALTHIER for some people to feel like they can eat anything they want in tiny amounts than it is to exist in a "no and never" mode where they feel socially isolated and emotionally/sensually deprived of food.

Mousesmom just said in that one line what I tried to say in my long rambling post.

When people advise you to use "willpower" what they are saying is use willpower to deny yourself the old bad habits and work on creating new, livable, good habits. The problem is people who are addicts don't realize their habits are bad (or alternately they don't know they're bad but they don't know how else to live)....so they don't see anything wrong with them really, or they don't realize how or that they should change them.

Therefore saying no becomes impossible, a pointless futile struggle.

Yes I second what potatofree wrote.

In the begining breaking the addictions and old habits is agony. It is not too much to ask, if you ask for your wifes help early on by keeping the food away from you. Once the addictions have been broken and old behaviors/coping mechanisms have been replaced with new ones, then the food no longer has the power over you it used to and you can more easily say no.

But ultimately you must realize your power and say no to the temptations. Your wife has done her part by not waving the food in your face. She is being cooperative by hiding the trigger food.
At this point it's all you. No one but you is sabotaging yourself by searching for her hiding spots. It's not her fault; she's keeping them out of your sight and way but you are going out of your way to find them. You must take responsibility for your self-destructive behavior and stop it. I know it's hard but I'm telling you this not because I'm getting off berating you, it's because I want you to succeed. I know the only way anyone will succeed is if they discover their own inner fount of strength and use it to make the transition easier. You just have to stop yourself from going out of your way to sabotage yourself.

You have your right to disagree with my statement, but I stand by it. There is no nutritional value to sugar and it has the potential to cause so many problems in the future (I wasn't always hypoglycemic and my aunt wasn't always diabetic and alot of people on here were not always overweight).

And the extreme black and white theory...I subscribe to this ONLY when it comes to drugs and sugar. I do believe in moderate amounts of alcohol and I am one of the most liberal people you will ever meet...there is alot of gray in my life. Please don't assume.

That being said, I still say it is poison. But I do agree on almost everything else you have said (although I need to block out long periods of time to read it )

...would you prefer the term "hazardous substance"?

That's not what addiction is about. Addicts know damn well their addictions are bad for them, and most wish they could change them, but are powerless to do so. It's actually part of the definition of addiction: to be powerless over the substance/situation/person/behavior to which you are addicted. Addicts can't say no, not consistently. It transcends "willpower." I have a ton of willpower in certain situations, but in others, none at all. So does everyone I know who battles addictions. The best you can do is try to build a wall between yourself and whatever the addiction is, to minimize the temptations, because eventually the temptation will almost certainly wear you down. It's simply a matter of time and Murphy's Law. To point to someone struggling with an addiction, cluck your tongue and say, "They just need some willpower," is one of the emptiest, most ignorant things people can say, but it's done all the time, particularly with food.

In a way, those of us with food/eating addictions are lucky, because you really can force your addiction into abeyance with a low carb diet -- and one slip won't beat you, as it would with drugs or alcohol, and one slip doesn't have catastrophic consequences. If you're a drunk, one slip and you're almost certainly going to be a drinking drunk again; if you're a carb addict, one slip isn't going to add 50 pounds to your thighs, and you have the next meal to get back on track.

At any rate, slight digression aside, people really need to get a better grip on just what an addiction is, even, perhaps especially, here. When it comes to eating issues, this is a community of glass houses, and throwing stones like "You just need some willpower," is likely to lead to a whole lot of broken glass and cut up feet.

cp

i understand believe me i understand. know this, it will come and it will go. there will be times when you would die before you ate a lot of carbs or any and there will be times when you try to eat every carb within a 5 mile radius.

ignore the attack nazis and just keep keeping on, if someone(note: i am not naming any poster here so dont assume i am attacking any particular poster here - this is in general) here does not understand what you are going through then there really is no point for them to comment much less attack you. you can do this but it is important to remember there will undoubtedly be times that you screw up, acknowledge it and go on. in times when there is little stress in your life it might not be a problem however when your stress goes up the temptations, addictions and cravings will occur (if you are an emotional eater like me) and they will probably be harder to fight but dont give up just go on.it is also easier to stay on plan away from home where there are less temptations

i lost 75 lbs on this woe and did not have any problems with cheating at all for about 2 years until i lost my stepson to suicide and then the stress was so bad you would have thought i was a heroin addict the way i was attacking carbs. i ate carbs like i have never before. i did eventually get it under control but it was hard.

good luck.

<takes a bow> Gee thanks Woo!

Julie

Many addicts are utterly unaware of their addictions. Denial goes hand in hand with addiction. They don't "damn well" know anything.

No one feels Craig's struggle more than those of us who have been there with addictions and gotten through it. Sharing with him that this is going to be a hard road, and that he's going to have to look solely to himself for the strength to make it endure, is not "bashing." It's sharing reality (which he's going to have to confront sooner or later anyways, and it might as well be sooner).

No one is "powerless" over an addiction. I've seen meth addicts, alcoholics, three pack a day smokers lay down their substances and walk away. To say that addicts are "powerless" over addictions is to rob the thousands who HAVE overcome them of the respect that they are due for what they have achieved. What exactly is your theory, that some of us were born with less of an addict gene than the rest, so we just didn't find it that hard to overcome our addictions? We took some sort of magic pill that caused it all to just go away? No. We just wanted it more, and worked for it harder.

Addictions are perfectly transcendable, and the only application that works is willpower. You either want to get clean from your addiction or you do not. No one said that it was easy, but very little worth having in life is.

BTW ... the "definition" of addiction does *not* include being "powerless" or incapable of change. It is, very simply: Compulsive physiological and psychological need for a habit-forming substance. The root of compulsive, is having the power to compel. Addictive substances are extremely compelling ... but they are not commanding.

Those of us who have overcome addictions are proud of it, and have every right to be. If that comes across to some as arrogant or condescending, then I would say that reaction says far more about those who percieve such pride as threatening, than it does about those of us who have successfully overcome addictions.

I would love nothing more than to share what I have learned on my journey with those who are further back on the path, and who need a helping hand or encouragement to make it to where I am. I'm not "bashing" or berating anyone. I'm simply stating the bald and immutable truth that you either get both feet on this road and take it seriously, or you fail. It's not pretty. It is nonetheless true.

Craig, it does sound as though you are suffering at least partially from an overeating disorder. The best advice I can give you, you may have already heard: When you yank something destructive out of your life, you have to fill the hole that's left with something constructive in order to make the change long lasting. With some it's exercise, with others religion or volunteering, heck get a puppy and start taking him for long walks to distract yourself. You have to have a plan for where you want to get to, in order to not lose your way. You can do this, and if necessary, you can do it alone. You'll have so much amazing self respect and newfound love for yourself when you get there, it will be well worth everything you go through on the way, and much more.

Incidentally, I would say that Kryssi deserves at least *as much* respect for changing her way of eating at a society-acceptable weight, if not *more,* than those of us who made the decision to do so because of the additional pressure of society to look differently. If I hadn't been so tired of looking the way I did, I don't know whether health reasons would have been enough to cause the kind of change that she made. I knew my weight was unhealthy because I could see it all around me every time I looked in a mirror.

Annnnd before anyone can hop in with the "you're not at goal yet you've only done a few months of this" ... overcoming my addition to carbs isn't what I'm most proud of, although I am *very* proud that (despite lots of carby foods in my pantry and office) I have managed to accomplish what I have.

I am also ...

...a former pack-a-day (minimum) smoker who simply decided to quit, and did.

...a former (and quite dedicated) oxycontin addict who literally flushed my entire month's worth of prescription down the toilet one day, and nearly died from the physical withdrawal that followed, not to mention the months of overcoming the mental and emotional addictions.

...granddaughter to a woman who smoked 3 packs a day from the age of 16 to the age of 68, went to the doctor one day and saw black spots (fortunately non-cancerous) on the x-ray of her lungs, and never smoked another cigarette. Still hasn't 10 years later.

...sister to a man with 8-year AA chips in his pocket...a man who used to have a beer in his hand before his feet hit the floor in the morning.

...sister to a woman who passed away from her inability to do what I and my brother did.

Katie, I am sorry for the loss of your sister. And I am so in awe of the strength of you and your family to conquer all of that. I wish you nothing but the best in this and ALL of your journeys. You have certainly paid your dues...

The majority of addicts I know quite clearly know they have a problem with their substance, even without the label "addiction." Being in "denial" does not necessarily exclude knowledge of the problem.



"Bashing" is a function of tone. Many of the early responses to Craig amounted to nothing more than accusatory chest beating. That ain't "sharing."




Before lecturing about the definition of a word or phrase (using what "you've seen" as the basis of a definition is pointless), you might do well in the future to actually look it up:



This definition, or a close variation thereof, is pretty much standard in addiction studies. Presumably, the people who study addiction as a profession "have seen" all sorts of behaviors, perhaps even more than you have.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/...4&dopt=Abstract



It is? Exactly how so?




The jails are full of people who apparently didn't want to "get clean of their addictions." (They were presumably also in denial about their $100 a day crack habit, according to you. While they were selling the furniture out from under themselves, selling their bodies and so on to feed their habit, they were "in denial.").

I'm going to stop at this point, because skimming through your post reveals it is essentially a waste of time. There are general agreements in the scientific community about the nature of addiction, and you are responding to those agreements with what "you've seen," and your own opinions about what addiction is and isn't, and what addicts can or can't do, and then trying to pass those opinions off as fact based on your own experience, and anecdotal examples. It comes down to what "you've seen" and your opinions, against what the people who actually make studying addiction their careers have seen and say (not to mention my own experiences with and observances of addiction, which I dare say are quite extensive). In this case, I'll go with the professionals. It didn't help any that when there is a generally agreed upon definition of a word, one that even most lay people know or have heard of, as it's part of the well known 12 step program to addiction recovery, you didn't know it. It's not the sort of thing that built my confidence in the validity of your opinions.