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  #421   ^
Old Mon, May-16-22, 03:25
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,177
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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I eat more than those minimums. The only pound:kilo conversion I reliably keep in my head is my own weight.
Ted Naiman's 1 gram protein per pound of ideal body weight is much simpler.

He has been saying 30% protein would cure world obesity and diabetes before this paper. A good beginner interview to the PE diet. The #1 Solution to the World's obesity problem https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...i=1000529446358

Her interview with Marty Kendall also good: How to Optimize Your Nutrients, Fasting and Health Results
https://bettlucas.com/2021/02/08/fa...loss-nutrients/

Last edited by JEY100 : Mon, May-16-22 at 04:00.
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  #422   ^
Old Mon, May-16-22, 05:26
JLx's Avatar
JLx JLx is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,708
 
Plan: High protein, lower fat
Stats: 235/199/186 Female 66
BF:276,255,233
Progress: 73%
Location: Michigan U.P., USA
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The averages we eat now, per DietDoctor (link as above):

Quote:
American men average 88 grams of protein per day, and women average 66 grams, which equates to only 14 to 16% of total calories. Of those protein calories, approximately 30% come from plant sources.

The main take-home message is that most people are likely not eating enough protein for weight loss, metabolic health, and improving lean muscle mass.


The take-home message for most people who hear "eat your ideal weight in protein grams" will mean eating twice as much protein as they're used to, or more. I brought this info to my in-person weight loss group and the reaction was horror.
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  #423   ^
Old Mon, May-16-22, 13:26
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
Posts: 3,833
 
Plan: Very LC, Higher Protein
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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I'm not surprised at that type of reaction. Animal protein is the most nutrient dense and satiating macro. It takes a bit of planning and use of multiple sources to optimize how much one really is able to consume. I can understand the shock given the mixed messages we typically see regarding nutrition.

Last edited by GRB5111 : Mon, May-16-22 at 13:35.
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  #424   ^
Old Tue, May-17-22, 04:16
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,177
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Agree with Rob. My first and only "real meal" yesterday was shrimp and veg stir-fry. Too lazy to use the scale, I used half a 16 oz package of shrimp, 57g protein and 5g fat. I've contributed to this same question in another membership group, the reaction to saying that I don’t eat bacon Is priceless. Apparently bacon is required

I "worked up" to those amounts using Marty's macronutrient course over months. And when I don’t reach the protein gram goal, I look at the Protein Percent for the meal or day. Shrimp or fish with veg or salad is a slam dunk for high protein percent. No way I could eat that much protein in a fattier food.

Last edited by JEY100 : Tue, May-17-22 at 07:10.
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  #425   ^
Old Tue, May-17-22, 13:19
kdc01's Avatar
kdc01 kdc01 is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 69
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 339.8/272.6/200 Male 71 inches
BF:
Progress: 48%
Location: virginia
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Jey100 -

I have been eating lots of shrimp for years and never knew it had that much protein. I love the fact that where we live you can buy fresh shrimp which is tastier than frozen.
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  #426   ^
Old Wed, May-18-22, 07:26
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 13,657
 
Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/125/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 136%
Location: USA
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Quote:
If you are very physically active, over 50 years old, or most of your protein comes from plant sources, we recommend aiming for the higher end of the protein range (above 1.6 grams per kilo per day). This means adding another 20 to 30 grams of protein to the targets above.


This Diet Doctor advice really struck me. They know plant protein is lower quality. I'm confident that site is backing up their advice with good studies, and this matches my own experience.

In fact, influenced by this thread (and my discovery I can make hot chocolate smoothies) I have been systematically upping my daily protein. Getting 50 grams of protein first thing in the morning is part of a cortisol resistance protocol I have returned to, with good results.

It just makes me all the angrier at all the plant-based everything that is appearing in the grocery store. I only get along with whey protein and that's harder to find that I would ever have thought.
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  #427   ^
Old Sun, May-22-22, 05:19
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,177
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Check out these results from the April 2022 DDF Challenge!!

https://optimisingnutrition.com/dat...l-2022-results/

Some new, some long timers, and the overall results from the entire class!

I feel like I cheated since I did not even participate in this challenge but that IS the ultimate goal.
I have "trained my hunger", know the general TRE window that works for me, have my "optimal 30/30 meals" and can cruise along around my goal weight. The goal for the first five months of 2022 was only to maintain, and restart June 1 when I add in 1-2 hours of aqua cardio and strength….we'll see how that goes

Last edited by JEY100 : Sun, May-22-22 at 05:26.
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  #428   ^
Old Sun, May-22-22, 06:31
thud123's Avatar
thud123 thud123 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 7,273
 
Plan: HP/LKcal (Q2-22)
Stats: 168/105/82 Male 182cm
BF:
Progress: 73%
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All so good!!
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  #429   ^
Old Sun, May-22-22, 11:12
dan_rose dan_rose is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 171
 
Plan: None, limit carbs, Omega6
Stats: 161/140/140 Male 5'10"
BF:
Progress: 100%
Location: Loughborough, UK
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Quote:
Minimum daily protein target:
Height Women Men
Under 5’4″ ( < 163 cm) 90 grams 105 grams
5’4″ to 5’7″ (163 to 170 cm) 100 grams 110 grams
5’8″ to 5’10” (171 to 178 cm) 110 grams 120 grams
5’11” to 6’2″ (179 to 188 cm) 120 grams 130 grams
Over 6’2″ (188 cm +) 130 grams 140 grams


I'm not knocking it but to me, these numbers seem high and difficult to reach. Do hunter-gatherer diets get anywhere near?
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  #430   ^
Old Sun, May-22-22, 11:46
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 12,177
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/27%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
Default

Hi Dan,
Most people have that reaction at first, know I did. But then it worked so well for weight loss, in addition to lowering my blood glucose, that I was willing to try it. I "worked up" to my ideal amount of protein; first with Marty Kendall's Macronutrient Masterclass, focused more on upping the Protein Percent of the diet.

Addendum to those ranges:

Quote:
As the chart indicates, you should try to get around 100 grams if you’re a woman and 120 grams if you’re a man of average height and build. Eat more if you’re a man taller than 6 feet (183 cm) or a woman taller than 5’6″ (168 cm) or if you’re very physically active. Eat less if you’re shorter or have a very small frame.

If you are very physically active, over 50 years old, or most of your protein comes from plant sources, we recommend aiming for the higher end of the protein range (above 1.6 grams per kilo per day). This means adding another 20 to 30 grams of protein to the targets above.

If you are physically active, want to achieve very low body fat (less than 10% for men or 20% for women), or regularly practice intermittent fasting, you may want to add even more protein. (My emphasis)


I am tall, 5’9”, have a large frame, and am Way Over 50 years old. I daily IF, and am moderately active (for my age) so 145 gram seems good target for me.

People eating a higher percentage of protein eat up to 60% fewer calories (without hunger). Good article explaining this with the data based on free-living challenge members.

Protein for Weight Loss: How Much You Need and Why it Works

https://optimisingnutrition.com/how...-your-appetite/

If you are not interested in weight loss, but would rather bulk up or gain weight, there are recommendations for that both in the PE Diet book and Optimising Nutrition, with good recipes for bulking (or so I’m told )


There are many good podcast interviews with Dr Ted Naiman in the thread about the PE diet. A new one downloaded today from Boundless Body Radio. He spent some time answering the question how a person eating the more common 60 grams of protein increases it. (Slowly, small changes, what food works easily, like the fermented low fat dairy)

Last edited by JEY100 : Mon, May-23-22 at 07:17.
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  #431   ^
Old Mon, May-23-22, 09:51
thud123's Avatar
thud123 thud123 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 7,273
 
Plan: HP/LKcal (Q2-22)
Stats: 168/105/82 Male 182cm
BF:
Progress: 73%
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Quote:
People eating a higher percentage of protein eat up to 60% fewer calories (without hunger). Good article explaining this with the data based on free-living challenge members.


This is really working for me. I'm male, over 50 and currently 105kg - For Q2 I've been shooting for daily protein >125g and <200g per day and shooting for a Protein:Energy ratio >1 - On average (I didn't bring the calculator out for this) i'm ingesting about 1300-1600 kcal per day according to Cronometer and not that hungry. Some days I go wild with hedonistic eating (usually sugar or starch involved) about 4 days last 8 weeks - if you're interested you can track back my numbers here in this thread (yesterday happened to be one of those hedonistic days):

https://forum.lowcarber.org/showthr...491#post9428491
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