Active Low-Carber Forums
Atkins diet and low carb discussion provided free for information only, not as medical advice.
Home Plans Tips Recipes Tools Stories Studies Products
Active Low-Carber Forums
A sugar-free zone


Welcome to the Active Low-Carber Forums.
Support for Atkins diet, Protein Power, Neanderthin (Paleo Diet), CAD/CALP, Dr. Bernstein Diabetes Solution and any other healthy low-carb diet or plan, all are welcome in our lowcarb community. Forget starvation and fad diets -- join the healthy eating crowd! You may register by clicking here, it's free!

Go Back   Active Low-Carber Forums > Main Low-Carb Diets Forums & Support > Exercise Forums: Active Low-Carbers > Beginner/Low Intensity
User Name
Password
FAQ Members Calendar Mark Forums Read Search Gallery My P.L.A.N. Survey


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   ^
Old Sat, Jan-28-12, 23:16
SSteinmetz SSteinmetz is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Low-Calorie; 1500 cals/d
Stats: 255/245/212 Male 67
BF:38/37/24
Progress: 23%
Default Heartrate, Perceived Exertion, etc.

I am trying to improve my cardiovascular fitness, but would like some input regarding my activities. I understand that anything I'm told isn't medical advice and that only a qualified medical professional should be the resource I use to make decisions regarding my health. I simply want others' input for my own uses.

Current situation analysis:

* I am a 24 year-old male who, as of January 28, 2012, weighs about 250 pounds. Body fat was measured at 37.08% using the Jackson-Pollock 3-point caliper method. (obesity is >25%)

* I do not engage in strength training exercises, but do cardiovascular activities. Activities are limited to an inside environment (gym) and include a recumbent bike and treadmill. A typical "high intensity" day includes 30 minutes on the bike and 15 to 30 minutes on the treadmill afterwards. A "low intensity" day features light cardiovascular activity for about 20 to 30 minutes. Days are split up into blocks. Each block is a period of time of 30 minutes or less and may be high intensity or low intensity.

* For high intensity blocks, my strategy is as follows: Increase intensity to get the heartrate up to 150. Maintain the heartrate between 150 to 160. When the heartrate reaches 160, start a countdown; after three minutes, lower the intensity of the exercise until the heartrate drops back down to 150. After it has consistently stayed at the lower 150's for ten minutes, another attempt at increasing the intensity (per the previous rules) may be made.

* For low intensity/recovery blocks, my strategy is as follows: Maintain intensity to keep the heartrate at 65% of its maximum. (126 bpm) If the heartrate increases beyond this limit, lower the intensity of the activity.

* In 2008, a cardiologist diagnosed me with the following: hyperlipidemia, stage 2 hypertension, and "mild reversible inferior defect." Temporary limits were placed on weight-lifting, but were eventually lifted.

People tell me that I should listen to my body, but -- as past experience with sugar cravings and hypoglycemia have taught me -- often my body lies to me. Exertion and stress is to expected during any type of physical exercise, but it is hard for me to tell when I am overexerting myself. I feel relief when I lower the intensity of the exercise, but that seems to be a natural response to lowering the difficulty in all situations; of course the body's not going to "want" to keep the intensity going. I don't "enjoy" the feeling of stressing my muscles and being short of breath, but I would presume that this is a part of the essence of training: doing something stressful repeatedly until you adapt and it is no longer stressful.

It's strange because there are times (especally with caffeine consumption) when I get on that bike and feel like the only thing that could stop me is shortness of breath, and there are other times that I can get on and have a low heartrate, full breath and be totally recovered, but the leg muscles themselves become extremely sore quickly during the workout -- even after a day of rest or active recovery. There are times when doing cardio that I can actually feel my heart pounding within my chest like it's threatening to jump out! I usually experience this sensation when the heartrate rises to 155 or higher. Other than this, however, I do not feel pain (other than what I perceive to be soreness), experience headaches, or feel dizzy.

Strangely enough, consuming caffeinated beverages (like coffee, iced tea, and so on) seems to increase my "tolerance" to this stress. Although my heartrate may rise to high levels, I do not feel "stressed" and my muscles do not feel sore during the workout. I draw the line for heartrate levels at 160 bpm, though; since I am not on a treadmill under the direct supervision of a cardiologist, I see no need to give myself a stress test. The most I've allowed my heartrate to reach during a workout is 170. If it becomes that high, I'll immediately lower the intensity of the exercise considerably to give myself an opportunity to recover mid-exercise.

Being properly hydrated and cooled also seem to have an influence on my heartrate. If I am dehydrated, my heartrate rises and the sensation of fatigue comes more quickly. If I am sweating, having a fan blow air on me to cool me down seems to keep my heartrate under control. Otherwise, I will tire more quickly and my heartrate will rise.

When starting a workout, my heartrate may also take time to reach a certain level that reflects the intensity of my workout. After research, I have identified this phenomenon as "cardiac drift."

I've researched the benefits of high-intensity exercise and have had the opportunities to experience them first-hand in the past. After an intense cardio session, I would experience improved mood and sleep more easily. So, I don't want "moderate" exercise; I want intense exercise. Of course, obvious pain, headaches, and dizziness are red flags that I always look out for to stop a workout; nevertheless, I can't help but wonder if my heart is working too much. If I otherwise feel fine when doing the workout, do I need to worry about my heartrate? Will something bad happen if I leave it in the 160's or beyond for an extended period of time? I may fatigue my muscles, but that's actually the end result I want to help them build up for the exercises I am doing.

Also, what role does my weight play in this? As a result of obesity, all physical activities I do require considerably more effort from my muscles and heart. My cardiologist advised that weight-lifting raises blood pressure. I infer that any activity that raises blood pressure must have an even more profound effect on obese individuals because of the increased effort of the muscles. Should I simply focus on changes to my diet and moderate intensity exercise until my body fat percentage drops to an acceptable level (24% isn't lean, but I'll take it!!), or should I stay the course to try to reap the benefits now?
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2   ^
Old Sat, Jan-28-12, 23:22
newlowc newlowc is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 451
 
Plan: Bernstein/Atkins
Stats: 275/265/190 Male 5'11"
BF:
Progress: 12%
Location: SOCAL
Default

how tall are you?
Reply With Quote
  #3   ^
Old Tue, Jan-31-12, 00:21
SSteinmetz SSteinmetz is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Low-Calorie; 1500 cals/d
Stats: 255/245/212 Male 67
BF:38/37/24
Progress: 23%
Default

5'7. I didn't include it in my first post because I don't view the BMI as a reliable method of calculating body fat. I did use a caliper, though, and determined it to be about 37.08%.
Reply With Quote
  #4   ^
Old Tue, Jan-31-12, 09:55
Seejay's Avatar
Seejay Seejay is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,025
 
Plan: Optimal Diet
Stats: 00/00/00 Female 62 inches
BF:
Progress: 8%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SSteinmetz
I simply want others' input for my own uses.
Not sure what exactly your questions are, but will try.

Quote:
* I do not engage in strength training exercises, but do cardiovascular activities.
What is your current goal with exercise?
Recovery from scary heart things, or improved health, or weight loss?
A cardio-only program is a problem for weight loss, for example.

Quote:
A typical "high intensity" day includes 30 minutes on the bike and 15 to 30 minutes on the treadmill afterwards. A "low intensity" day features light cardiovascular activity for about 20 to 30 minutes. Days are split up into blocks. Each block is a period of time of 30 minutes or less and may be high intensity or low intensity.
That is a lot of glucose-burning exercise. Are you doing it every day? What carb amounts do you use to support this level of intensity of exercise?

Quote:
Exertion and stress is to expected during any type of physical exercise
Actually no, because exercise includes low-level too, where the perceived exertion is low, and the physical effects of stress are low. But I get that you are interested in higher stress exercse.

Quote:
it is hard for me to tell when I am overexerting myself.
Join the club! that is a trial-and-error thing over time where you learn how your body responds to your total program: exercise, food, and rest. You need data from all three to figger it out.

Quote:
I can't help but wonder if my heart is working too much. If I otherwise feel fine when doing the workout, do I need to worry about my heartrate?
I think it pays to pay attention, yes. google Mark Sisson's posts on "chronic cardio" for the longer-term effects of frequent intense cardio.

Quote:
Will something bad happen if I leave it in the 160's or beyond for an extended period of time?
It might. How beyond and for how much time? Here are symptoms of overdoing the cardio (again from Sissons)

Quote:
The costs of chronic (repetitious) mid- and high-level aerobic work
- requires large amounts of dietary carbohydrates (SUGAR)
- decreases efficient fat metabolism
- increases stress hormone cortisol
- increases systemic inflammation
- increases oxidative damage (free radical production)
- boring!


Read more: http://www.marksdailyapple.com/case.../#ixzz1l3Fzipnt

Quote:
Also, what role does my weight play in this? ... Should I simply focus on changes to my diet and moderate intensity exercise until my body fat percentage drops to an acceptable level (24% isn't lean, but I'll take it!!), or should I stay the course to try to reap the benefits now?
Personally I would want to get the weight off first. Literally a drag to exercise with it, ha ha. And a 3-pronged program is better for weight loss for me BY FAR than one that only has moderate-high intensity cardio. Again like Sisson's recommendations: low-level exercise every day, intense cardio 1-2 times a week, weight training 2-3 times a week. He has an ebook "Primal Fitness" that is an easy way to get started.
Reply With Quote
  #5   ^
Old Thu, Feb-02-12, 14:30
Sam Knox's Avatar
Sam Knox Sam Knox is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 47
 
Plan: My own
Stats: 211/179/175 Male 6'3"
BF:
Progress: 89%
Location: Richland, Washington
Default

Your description didn't mention the frequency of exercise sessions.

How many days a week do you exercise, and do you include both high and low intensity sessions on the same day?
Reply With Quote
  #6   ^
Old Fri, Feb-03-12, 19:41
scottie123 scottie123 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 126
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 265/231/175 Male 72 inches
BF:265/231/175
Progress: 38%
Default

A few comments.

Exercising and your body wanting to or feeling up for it are very independent. In my past life, I ran daily. Some day getting out the door seemed like a win. How I felt and how I performed were not always related. Your body gives you a lot of spurious information. Especially on training runs were you are just doing it to get it done or are slightly bored. That why most people depend on good watches, accurate maps and log books.

Are you over-exerting yourself? My test is the talking test. Basically get moving -- and when at your "speed" see if you can talk without become more winded. If not, you are below what you can do. Actually when you reached this point you might be only 60-75% of your possible output.

It is really hard to go too fast or too hard. Generally you will just stop. I have had that happen more than once. Not the end of the world. Now that could be really bad if you are 7 miles from home with no cell phone and it is getting dark and starting to rain. You might regret the effort the next day -- sore muscles and joints. But that is a different thing.
Reply With Quote
  #7   ^
Old Mon, Feb-06-12, 10:23
SSteinmetz SSteinmetz is offline
New Member
Posts: 21
 
Plan: Low-Calorie; 1500 cals/d
Stats: 255/245/212 Male 67
BF:38/37/24
Progress: 23%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seejay
What is your current goal with exercise?


Reduce body fat percentage and improve exercise tolerance. I want to improve my cardiovascular fitness so that I can burn more calories in shorter period of time, thus making my use of time more efficient.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seejay
That is a lot of glucose-burning exercise. Are you doing it every day? What carb amounts do you use to support this level of intensity of exercise?


Yes, I do it every day. I generally alternate between "high intensity" days and "low intensity" days in order to afford myself a chance to recovery.

I am not on a low carb nutritional strategy at the moment. If I had to estimate, I'd guess that my average daily carb intake is anywhere between 140 and 200 grams per day.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seejay
It might. How beyond and for how much time? Here are symptoms of overdoing the cardio (again from Sissons)


My heartrate may, from time to time, go beyond 160 bpm to 170 bpm. If it becomes that high, I'll slow the exercise down without hesitation until I've remained in the 140's for a few minutes. Then the intensity will gradually increase to ensure that I don't reach 170 again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seejay
Again like Sisson's recommendations: low-level exercise every day, intense cardio 1-2 times a week, weight training 2-3 times a week. He has an ebook "Primal Fitness" that is an easy way to get started.


Thank you! I think I'll research it!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Scottie123
Are you over-exerting yourself? My test is the talking test. Basically get moving -- and when at your "speed" see if you can talk without become more winded. If not, you are below what you can do. Actually when you reached this point you might be only 60-75% of your possible output.


I actually wanted to work so hard that I fail the "talk test." I thought this would be an indication that I'm pushing my body to the limits, which I hypothesized would result in an increase in work capacity.
Reply With Quote
  #8   ^
Old Mon, Feb-06-12, 13:00
Sam Knox's Avatar
Sam Knox Sam Knox is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 47
 
Plan: My own
Stats: 211/179/175 Male 6'3"
BF:
Progress: 89%
Location: Richland, Washington
Default

"Reduce body fat percentage and improve exercise tolerance. I want to improve my cardiovascular fitness so that I can burn more calories in shorter period of time, thus making my use of time more efficient."

Most people find that, over time, exercise alone has very little effect on fat-loss. Calories burned during exercise tend to be replaced in the diet.

On the other hand, there are lots of other good reasons to exercise, and cardiovascular fitness is certainly one of them.

It looks like you're already doing a kind of interval training, and that's the most time-efficient way to improve cardiovascular fitness. If you want a more formal structure to work with you can try 30 second "sprints" between 4 minute rest periods. Six of these intervals is roughly equivalent to two hours of continuous exercise at ~70% of maximum heart rate.

Obviously, you can increase the intensity by lengthening the sprints or shortening the rest periods, but sessions longer than 30 minutes aren't likely to offer any improvements that justify the increased time or effort.

(A note on heart-rate: It's true that if you are overweight or obese, your heart has to work harder than if you are lean, but that shows up in the heart-rate. For a given age and level of fitness, the same heart-rate reflects the same level of cardiovascular stress regardless of body size.)
Reply With Quote
  #9   ^
Old Mon, Feb-06-12, 15:39
Seejay's Avatar
Seejay Seejay is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,025
 
Plan: Optimal Diet
Stats: 00/00/00 Female 62 inches
BF:
Progress: 8%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SSteinmetz
Reduce body fat percentage and improve exercise tolerance. I want to improve my cardiovascular fitness so that I can burn more calories in shorter period of time, thus making my use of time more efficient.
Burning more calories in a shorter time - you could do that either by being predominantly a sugar burner, or a fat burner.

From Couzens the triathlete coach who talks about better performance, fewer injuries, longer, faster endurance cardio -
AFTER the person becomes a fat burner.

Improving Fat Oxidation

http://www.endurancecorner.com/node/336

Quote:
#1. There is a wide variation in the amount of fat that is oxidized at rest.

Some of the athletes were deriving almost 100% of their resting energy from fat, while others were only deriving 25%. This has HUGE implications on athletes who struggle with body composition. By increasing your rate of fat oxidation at rest, you could potentially lose body fat 4x faster than you currently are!!! Not to mention preserving your precious glycogen stores for your next training session.

#2. Those subjects who burned more fat at rest also burned more fat at ALL EXERCISE INTENSITIES (see chart)

Even at 70% VO2max, some of the subjects who were 100% fat burners at rest were still deriving 40% of their energy from fat (think G), while in the athletes who were poor fat burners at rest, fat burning had completely shut down (think me, or you??)

So, what were the distinguishing factors between the ‘corvette’ athletes and the ‘prius’ athletes? Interestingly the factors changed somewhat with increasing exercise intensity.

a) The concentration of Free Fatty Acids within the blood

This is THE pre-requisite for fat burning at rest and all exercise intensities. In other words, if your blood is full of glucose as opposed to FFA’s, you will not be providing the muscles with any stimulus to ‘learn’ to use fat as a fuel. High FFA levels (and low-moderate blood glucose levels) are a pre-requisite for fat burning. This has LARGE nutritional implications. If you keep your blood sugar levels perpetually elevated, you will never become a fat burner. Period.

b) The concentration of fat-burning enzymes within the muscle.

While short chain and medium chain FFA’s can diffuse into the mitochondria freely, long chain FFA’s must ‘hitch a ride’ with the enzyme carnitine palmitoyl-transferase in order to make it to the mitochondria. A shortage of this enzyme will mean that even if you have sufficient FFA’s within the blood, the long chain ones will be left by the side of the road with their thumb in the air waiting to hitch a ride. This enzyme is inhibited in the post absorptive state when blood glucose is elevated.

c) Mitochondrial content within the muscle.

Of course, in order for FFA’s to be ‘burned’ and used for fuel we need a sufficient number of ‘engines’ to burn them. In this sense, the number of mitochondria within the muscle can ultimately limit the rates of fat oxidation. This is a function of aerobic fitness, which in turn is a function of the number of contractions performed by each muscle fiber, or put another way, as my buddy Chuckie V is fond of saying, miles make champions.

So, there you have it – 2 simple ways to turn yourself into a fat-burning machine:

1. Cut sugar from your diet (and moderate total CHO intake)

2. Train MORE in your aerobic zones (cut out the hard stuff until you’re ready for it).
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 00:29.


Copyright © 2000-2024 Active Low-Carber Forums @ forum.lowcarber.org
Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.