Active Low-Carber Forums
Atkins diet and low carb discussion provided free for information only, not as medical advice.
Home Plans Tips Recipes Tools Stories Studies Products
Active Low-Carber Forums
A sugar-free zone


Welcome to the Active Low-Carber Forums.
Support for Atkins diet, Protein Power, Neanderthin (Paleo Diet), CAD/CALP, Dr. Bernstein Diabetes Solution and any other healthy low-carb diet or plan, all are welcome in our lowcarb community. Forget starvation and fad diets -- join the healthy eating crowd! You may register by clicking here, it's free!

Go Back   Active Low-Carber Forums > Main Low-Carb Diets Forums & Support > Low Carb Health & Technical Forums > Tips and Stalls
User Name
Password
Register FAQ Members Calendar Mark Forums Read Search Gallery My P.L.A.N. Survey


Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 09:08
aj_cohn's Avatar
aj_cohn aj_cohn is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,948
 
Plan: Protein Power
Stats: 213/167/165 Male 65 in.
BF:35%/23%/20%
Progress: 96%
Location: United States
Default Potential Causes of Plateauing on Very Carbohydrate-Restricted Diets

Steve Hamley, author of the Paleo Premise blog, has posted an entry "Troubleshooting Weight Loss on Low Carb Diets." It's rather long to post here, so I'll post just the conclusion:
Quote:
If carb restriction is working for you thatís great, but if itís not, then consider increasing carbs. Keep looking until youíre happy with where you are or the direction youíre heading in.
Reply With Quote
Sponsored Links
  #2   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 09:46
cnmLisa's Avatar
cnmLisa cnmLisa is offline
Every day is day one
Posts: 7,776
 
Plan: AtkinsMaintenance/IF
Stats: 185/145/155 Female 5'5
BF:
Progress: 133%
Location: Oregon Coast
Default

Quote:
If carb restriction is working for you thatís great, but if itís not, then consider increasing carbs. Keep looking until youíre happy with where you are or the direction youíre heading in.


Hmmmm....
Dr. A had it right all along.
CLIMB the F'n carb ladder!

This is what many of the successful LCrs have figured out. You'd think when we advise this to people who are stalled out and been keeping to induction levels the whole time, you'd think we had suggested boiling kittens. And do they listen??? Nooooooooo...they thrash and whine and knash there teeth until maybe they finally try it and begin to lose again. Sometimes it just makes my palm itch (did that come off as cranky?!)

Just call me cranky pants this morning
Reply With Quote
  #3   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 11:00
Judynyc's Avatar
Judynyc Judynyc is offline
Attitude is a Choice
Posts: 29,985
 
Plan: SBD->atkins twist->paleo
Stats: 274/000/160 Female 5'6"
BF:stl/too/mch
Progress: 240%
Location: NYC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cnmLisa
Hmmmm....
Dr. A had it right all along.
CLIMB the F'n carb ladder!

This is what many of the successful LCrs have figured out. You'd think when we advise this to people who are stalled out and been keeping to induction levels the whole time, you'd think we had suggested boiling kittens. And do they listen??? Nooooooooo...they thrash and whine and knash there teeth until maybe they finally try it and begin to lose again. Sometimes it just makes my palm itch (did that come off as cranky?!)

Just call me cranky pants this morning

OK cranky pants!
But you're right! and it is crazy making!

AJ- good post and point!
Reply With Quote
  #4   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 12:19
Liz53's Avatar
Liz53 Liz53 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,140
 
Plan: Mostly Fung/IDM
Stats: 165/138.4/135 Female 63
BF:???/better/???
Progress: 89%
Location: Washington state
Default

Hmmm, very interesting post - and responses. As one who 1) has been stalled for a while and 2) does not believe in boiling kittens, you've got my attention. Lots to think about......

The fact that Judy and Lisa have lost >100% of what they set out to lose makes this idea that much more interesting.
Reply With Quote
  #5   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 12:54
MandalayVA's Avatar
MandalayVA MandalayVA is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,545
 
Plan: whole foods
Stats: 240/183/140 Female 64 inches
BF:too f'ing much
Progress: 57%
Location: Richmond, VA
Default

Why is it that going the opposite way--dropping or even eliminating carbs--isn't suggested?

Then there's this:

Quote:
Jimmy Moore has suggested his infertility and weight loss problems are due to low testosterone. I wonder if his weight increased only after he started exercising.


No, Steve, his weight increased because he's addicted to LC frankenfoods. I think he did manage to get off diet soda--he no longer posts his menus, claiming that they'd served their purpose, but in reality it was because people were getting on him about the frankenfoods, which he eats in quantity.
Reply With Quote
  #6   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 14:52
Judynyc's Avatar
Judynyc Judynyc is offline
Attitude is a Choice
Posts: 29,985
 
Plan: SBD->atkins twist->paleo
Stats: 274/000/160 Female 5'6"
BF:stl/too/mch
Progress: 240%
Location: NYC
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Liz53
Hmmm, very interesting post - and responses. As one who 1) has been stalled for a while and 2) does not believe in boiling kittens, you've got my attention. Lots to think about......

The fact that Judy and Lisa have lost >100% of what they set out to lose makes this idea that much more interesting.

Great! I like your attitude!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mandalay
Why is it that going the opposite way--dropping or even eliminating carbs--isn't suggested?

Really? You want to go there?

OK, how about adrenal fatigue and low thyroid function.
I've seen women doing M&E for years not losing anything and remain sure that they will. Whats the definition of insanity?

I believe that upping carb levels(with good carbs) when stalled out for a long time will actually ignite metabolism.
Its like stoking a fire, it needs fuel and oxygen to burn. Take away the oxygen and it goes out, take away the fuel and it goes out. But with both, it ignites.
Reply With Quote
  #7   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 14:57
Nancy LC's Avatar
Nancy LC Nancy LC is offline
Experimenter
Posts: 25,407
 
Plan: Paleo 99.5%
Stats: 210/170/160 Female 67.5"
BF:
Progress: 80%
Location: San Diego, CA
Default

I've been stalled at both higher and lower carb levels, so while perhaps this is true for some, it doesn't apply to everyone.
Reply With Quote
  #8   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-12, 19:58
Lois55's Avatar
Lois55 Lois55 is offline
Keto Lab Rat
Posts: 3,211
 
Plan: Low carb...WB detox...IF
Stats: 240/201.8/150 Female 5' 3"
BF:The Lab Rats :-)
Progress: 42%
Location: SE Sask. Canada
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Nancy LC
I've been stalled at both higher and lower carb levels, so while perhaps this is true for some, it doesn't apply to everyone.


And I would also suggest that what works now, may not work down the road. I've done lower and higher carbs as well on this journey. But I found more success lowering carbs after having them high than the other way around.
Reply With Quote
  #9   ^
Old Sat, Mar-31-12, 15:38
pollyanna1's Avatar
pollyanna1 pollyanna1 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 943
 
Plan: Atkins & JUDDD
Stats: 180/168.0/136 Female 5'2"
BF:& 5'2" Age 67
Progress: 27%
Location: USA
Default

Well, I purposely ate vegetable 26 carbs today to test this theory. Sure hope I won't regret it tomorrow morning when I weigh!

I assume that you don't reduce the normal level of fats when you do this - or that you don't increase calories drastically?

Last edited by pollyanna1 : Sat, Mar-31-12 at 15:53.
Reply With Quote
  #10   ^
Old Sat, Mar-31-12, 16:44
PilotGal PilotGal is online now
Registered Member
Posts: 36,353
 
Plan: KetoCarnivore
Stats: 206.6/178/160 Female 5'7
BF:awesome
Progress: 61%
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by pollyanna1
I assume that you don't reduce the normal level of fats when you do this - or that you don't increase calories drastically?
when you raise your carbohydrate level, you must drop your fat/protein level..
otherwise you'll gain weight.
you can't have both...

that's why low carb is unforgiving...
and as Nancy said, "what works for some, may not work for others."

when i raise my carb level, i balloon!
Reply With Quote
  #11   ^
Old Sat, Mar-31-12, 17:49
joel381's Avatar
joel381 joel381 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,022
 
Plan: Keto IF
Stats: 275/242.8/192 Male 72
BF:
Progress: 39%
Location: Michigan
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by aj_cohn
Steve Hamley, author of the Paleo Premise blog, has posted an entry "Troubleshooting Weight Loss on Low Carb Diets." It's rather long to post here, so I'll post just the conclusion:

He mentions this pretty early..
Quote:
Some forms of exercise donít agree with VLC diets. VLC dieters tend to have low glycogen stores, which are needed for intense exercise.

Yet often I see adamant statements from some that HIIT on almost zero carb works just fine. They must have a special physiology that can replenish glycogen fast without carbs, Peter Attia comes to mind as having this ability.
Reply With Quote
  #12   ^
Old Sat, Mar-31-12, 22:03
pollyanna1's Avatar
pollyanna1 pollyanna1 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 943
 
Plan: Atkins & JUDDD
Stats: 180/168.0/136 Female 5'2"
BF:& 5'2" Age 67
Progress: 27%
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by PilotGal
when you raise your carbohydrate level, you must drop your fat/protein level..
otherwise you'll gain weight.
you can't have both...

that's why low carb is unforgiving...
and as Nancy said, "what works for some, may not work for others."

when i raise my carb level, i balloon!



So, are you saying that I should keep the same number of CALORIES as I normally use - but just get more carbs in there WHICH WOULD OFFSET both protein and fat levels?

Or are you saying to eat enough carbs to get out of ketosis AND TOTALLY SKIP THE FAT?

Last edited by pollyanna1 : Sat, Mar-31-12 at 22:12.
Reply With Quote
  #13   ^
Old Sun, Apr-01-12, 06:12
Liz53's Avatar
Liz53 Liz53 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,140
 
Plan: Mostly Fung/IDM
Stats: 165/138.4/135 Female 63
BF:???/better/???
Progress: 89%
Location: Washington state
Default

Not Pilot Gal,but my understanding is that everyone's body needs a certain level of calories per day - and of course that may vary from day to day according to activity. The advantage of low carb is that it takes you off of the blood glucose/insulin roller coaster that results in eating before you have used up all the fuel from your last meal - in other words you are eating for reasons other than true hunger. Once you eliminate that extra eating, you are back down to levels of food needed to fuel yourself, not to satisfy hunger brought on by low blood sugar. Less food and fewer calories without hunger allows weight loss.

What do you mean by totally skip the fat? It doesn't take much to keep you out of ketosis - >50 total carbs per day. There is still room for plenty of fat.
Reply With Quote
  #14   ^
Old Sun, Apr-01-12, 08:51
JLx's Avatar
JLx JLx is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,224
 
Plan: Eat less, less often
Stats: 213.5/204/190 Female 66
BF:276,255,235,214
Progress: 40%
Location: Michigan U.P., USA
Default

Thanks for pointing out that interesting blog post. I suspect that different reasons for plateauing are relevant to different people and at different times in their lives.

I think the cortisol connection is what's relevant to me right now, along with the adrenal fatigue and low thyroid function that Judy mentioned. I keep thinking if I drop my carbs, I'll lose faster but I don't.

Excess cortisol can hinder your weight loss efforts. Cortisol/stress increases ghrelin, a hormone that increases appetite [1]. ... Cortisol also increases intestinal permeability and inflammation [3], which are both major factors in obesity.

Some forms of exercise donít agree with VLC diets. VLC dieters tend to have low glycogen stores, which are needed for intense exercise. This is simply because glycolysis (glucose) has a faster turnover rate of ATP compared with beta-oxidation (fat). In the same podcast Mat discusses how carb restriction and intense exercise cause a rise in cortisol and later, a fall in testosterone.

What about in women?

The last time I failed to keep weight off, it was during tax season as usual when I work long hours for a CPA, have a long commute and in general experience more stress. To counteract it I was exercising more to reduce stress when in hindsight, I think I only made things worse.
Reply With Quote
  #15   ^
Old Sun, Apr-01-12, 11:09
Seejay's Avatar
Seejay Seejay is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,025
 
Plan: Optimal Diet
Stats: 00/00/00 Female 62 inches
BF:
Progress: 8%
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joel381
Yet often I see adamant statements from some that HIIT on almost zero carb works just fine. They must have a special physiology that can replenish glycogen fast without carbs, Peter Attia comes to mind as having this ability.
If you wait enough days between HIIT, glycogen stores get refilled with the glucose made from gluconeogenesis. Dr. Eades mentioned some research that showed that the first place "new glucose" went, was to glycogen.

Also, the amount of glycogen an athlete can store, you can train for it so you have more glycogen storage for explosive exercise. It's a training adaptation. Plus people vary according to their mix of muscle type and glycogen storage to begin with.

HIIT every day would be just as glucose-demanding as long hard cardio every day. I seem to remember most HIIT advocates also advocate days between sessions. Something that appealed to me
Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -6. The time now is 09:26.


Copyright © 2000-2020 Active Low-Carber Forums @ forum.lowcarber.org
Powered by: vBulletin, Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.