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  #271   ^
Old Fri, Jun-04-21, 09:17
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 13,443
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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My library declined to purchase it (sometimes a function of budget left at end of June cycle) so I ordered the Kindle. I wished the emphasis had been a bit less on Otto, and more on the science (the four chapters in Part 5), but that is my own interest. Not that he was boring…Otto certainly was a character! how he slipped through the cracks in sight of Nazis, makes for a good story. He leaves Berlin for his summer house on an island, and his life goes on untouched? Continues his work under the occupation forces like nothing happened? Part 5 was well written, bringing the current leaders in the field, e.g. Cantley, Thompson, Mukherjee, and my radiologist Colin Champ, into the story of how insulin may be involved with cancer metabolism. Book
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  #272   ^
Old Fri, Jun-04-21, 10:56
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
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Posts: 14,684
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEY100
My library declined to purchase it (sometimes a function of budget left at end of June cycle) so I ordered the Kindle. I wished the emphasis had been a bit less on Otto, and more on the science (the four chapters in Part 5), but that is my own interest. Book


Good to hear! I pre-ordered it. And there it is
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  #273   ^
Old Mon, Jun-07-21, 07:07
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 13,443
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Low Carb MD podcast today is with Sam Apple, author of Ravenous:
https://lowcarbmd.com/episode-178-sam-apple

Quote:
In this discussion, Tro, Brian, and Sam talk about the role of metabolic health in preventing cancer, the effect that hyperinsulinemia has an cancer growth, the Warburg Effect and the work of Otto Warburg as it pertains to cancer cell research, how sugar, stress, and poor sleep habits raise insulin, the unfortunate lack of emphasis on preventative treatments for cancer in research, how the rise in cancer diagnoses follows the same curve as the rise of the western diet, and whether there is a diet out there that treats cancer.

Last edited by JEY100 : Mon, Jun-07-21 at 07:22.
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  #274   ^
Old Mon, Jun-07-21, 11:13
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
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Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Thanks, Janet! Looking forward to the listen. Book on my "digital night table" in the read-soon pile.
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  #275   ^
Old Sun, Jul-04-21, 20:36
s93uv3h's Avatar
s93uv3h s93uv3h is offline
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Plan: Atkins & IF / TRE
Stats: 000/000/000 Male 5' 10"
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Progress: 97%
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  #276   ^
Old Mon, Jul-05-21, 03:19
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
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Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
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Location: USA
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My Scribd account has it on audiobook. Thanks!
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  #277   ^
Old Sun, Jul-11-21, 13:22
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 13,443
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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I also got Metabolical from the library about a week ago. Although it is interesting, it is also a bit repetitive of Fat Chance and other articles by Dr Lustig. I'll finish it …sometime…but meanwhile my attention has been grabbed by Eat Like the Animals.

https://www.amazon.com/Eat-Like-Ani...e/dp/0358561892

Drs. Raubenheimer and Simpson are the two biologists, who through a study of locust feeding behaviors, and follow-on human studies, developed the Protein Leverage Hypothesis. Dr Ted Naiman and Marty Kendall base much of their popular diet strategies on this theory. The book makes a very clear case for the importance of protein in a narrow % of total calories, and the human need to overeat fat and carbs to get it that amount. Funny, compelling, I love the writing.

Book Review: https://optimisingnutrition.com/eat...ist/#more-19959

A multi-episode podcast about the book with the authors.
https://anchor.fm/eatliketheanimals...ientists-eevltt
Even with titles like Petrol in your ice cream, if you don’t have time for this long a review….

A one hour podcast interview with them https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podca...i=1000525429669

Last edited by JEY100 : Sun, Jul-11-21 at 13:29.
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  #278   ^
Old Mon, Jul-12-21, 07:46
BawdyWench's Avatar
BawdyWench BawdyWench is offline
Posts: 8,793
 
Plan: Carnivore
Stats: 212/179/160 Female 5'6"
BF:
Progress: 63%
Location: Rural Maine
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I was very disappointed in Metabolical. The gist of the book is, "Don't eat processed foods." He stresses that fiber is the most important element of diet. Heavy on plants. Eat enough fiber and you'll be fine. He doesn't bash protein (or red meat, which is refreshing, though he says to avoid deli meats because they're processed), but focuses on fiber and fibrous veggies. He says that applesauce made with with no sugar added is akin to apple juice because it has no fiber, and therefore not worth eating.

He says on keto you can miss important nutrients, so it's not great. He says being vegan you can also miss important nutrients, but you can always supplement. Why didn't he say you can supplement on keto? But then in another part of the book he says you shouldn't need to supplement if you eat real foods. He also says canola oil can be good for you. Talk about a processed food!

Here are some things I thought were interesting (for good or bad reasons) in the book.

He says that nutrition labels are not accurate because your microbiome actually metabolizes 25-30% of everything you eat, plus fiber isn't digested. He says this is especially true for nuts, "where the amount of calories absorbed is a full 30% less than those generated from a bomb calorimeter" and that some manufacturers are now changing the nutrition labels to reflect this. So how do I know if the label on the container of nuts I'm eating has been lowered or not?

"Every single drug company spends more on marketing than on research and development. Some, like Johnson & Johnson, spend double their R&D budget on marketing.... For every $1 spent on 'basic research,' Big Pharma spends $19 on promotions and advertising."

Also says that blood glucose does not always correlate with insulin release, and it's the insulin release you need to pay attention to ... but there's no way to do that on your own.

Equates drinking 2 beverages with artificial sweeteners equates to 1 beverage sweetened with sugar. He's opposed to using any artificial sweeteners at all. He makes no mention of stevia or other natural sweeteners like monkfruit. He says natural sugars contain both glucose and fructose, and fructose is bad, bad, bad. He says sugar, high-fructose corn syrup, honey, maple syrup, and agave are all metabolically the same and all bad for you. So maybe monkfruit falls into this category as well, maybe even stevia.

He says if you follow a low-fat diet, you end up destroying all the big fluffy LCL particles, which leaves you with the small, dense particles that are actually dangerous. Early in the book he also talks about how doctors prescribe statins and a low-fat diet for high LDL. He says, "It isn't just the pill that's the problem. The recommendation of a low-fat diet is just as bad for you (see Chapter 12)." In Chapter 12 he cites studies like one that followed 9,000 patients over 5 years at state mental hospitals and nursing homes "where meals were controlled by removing saturated fat and substituting linoleic acid (from corn oil)." In the end, LDL went down, but heart attacks and deaths went up. However, he doesn't describe the diet as low-fat, just not using saturated fat. He doesn't really explain why he thinks a low-fat diet is dangerous.

Probiotics? Worthless. Says the theory is that you take probiotics and you assume they will proliferate in your gut. Not so. If they did, he argues, why would you have to keep taking them? Also, probiotics are totally worthless without first taking prebiotics.

He doesn't think much of protein, either. He states, "... your kidneys have a limited capacity to excrete the metabolic by-products of protein metabolism, and overexcretion can cause kidney damage." This has been debunked by most of the LC researchers and experts out there. Then he says that if you eat too much protein, it will be turned into liver fat or into excess glucose. Again, I've read numerous times that it's been determined that gluconeogenesis is demand-driven, not supply-driven, so just because there's excess protein around it won't be converted to sugar.

He lists health problems associated with beef consumption: iron, BCAAs, and choline (which contains a by-product that sticks to your arteries and causes vascular disease and leads to insulin resistance).

Also says that plants (carbs) are bad because of all the synthetic fertilizers sprayed on them.

So what are we supposed to eat? Real food, yes, but exactly what since he's just said there are issues with plants, fat, and protein.

Fiber. He says fiber is the absolute most important thing to focus on.

He says studies have shown no difference in outcome whether you're on a low-fat diet or a low-carb diet (again, debunked by numerous studies). The only thing that makes a difference is eating Real Food (capitalization is his). He says any diet will work, but you have to eat Real Food. Still, he says the "low-sugar, high-fiber" Mediterranean diet is the best.

Oh, and no bibliography. He says it's online. That's a cop-out. I don't want to read the book and have to be next to my computer to check references.

Sorry this was so long.
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  #279   ^
Old Mon, Jul-12-21, 08:16
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 13,443
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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Thank you, Bawdy! I loved that it was a long review...you may have saved me from finishing the book. I'm not that far into it but as you said, the same message ...don't eat processed foods, fructose will kill you quicker than others and fiber will fix what your diet messed up was already covered.
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  #280   ^
Old Mon, Jul-12-21, 08:32
BawdyWench's Avatar
BawdyWench BawdyWench is offline
Posts: 8,793
 
Plan: Carnivore
Stats: 212/179/160 Female 5'6"
BF:
Progress: 63%
Location: Rural Maine
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My pleasure! I really liked the first half of the book, but kept waiting for his advice on what to eat. As I said, he had terrible things to say about protein, fat, AND carbs. I read the first half of the book but scanned the last half.

If I ate as much fiber as he recommends, I'd end up in the hospital with a bad case of diverticulitis.
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  #281   ^
Old Mon, Jul-12-21, 09:59
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
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Posts: 4,044
 
Plan: Very LC, Higher Protein
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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Excellent review, Bawdy. I'm no longer intrigued by this title. There's a long line of people who claim certain foods are unhealthy; yet, offer no real solution. The recommendation of the Mediterranean diet is humorous, as it can be interpreted in so many ways that for me don't work at all. My conclusion is it too often represents the general recommendation today by those who aren't able to be clear or specific about what constitutes healthy food consumption. As for the recommendation of fiber, that's been a common, and for many, ineffective guideline for a long time.
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  #282   ^
Old Mon, Jul-12-21, 13:09
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Posts: 19,235
 
Plan: atkins, carnivore 2023
Stats: 225/224/163 Female 5'8"
BF:
Progress: 2%
Location: Massachusetts
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Applesauce. As a teen fascinated with cooking, I picked the neglected apple trees on the property and made quarts of applesauce.

Cut whole and boiled, then thru the Foley food mill. Only peels, seeds, and core removed. Essentially eating a peeled apple.....well maybe not as the peels have steeped in the liquid.And assuming core not eaten.

Can't see a loss of fiber level. Perhaps an increase in GI as it's well cooked, break i ng down the cells.

Given all that, fiber is still there in applesauce.


Veggies. I'm a proponent of veggies. According to Atkins we can still eat veggies and stay in ketosis. The level, number of carbs, is individual; my level different than the next person. I'm high risk for colon cancer, ADD and Asbergers.......so gut function is very important to brain function and preventing colon cancer. The important microbes produce biochemicals for our health and vegetable matter feeds them.

The doc that handled my first colonoscopy said to increase fiber. Drink Consyl or similar named fiber. It's struck me as odd as it's only insoluble grain fiber. Imo our gut needs the full range of fibers, Soluble and insoluble, provided by real vegetables and fruit/berries. Also, the flavonoids and other compounds not in meats bring added support. I quickly move to real vegetables and some fruits. Because I researched beyond the limited info initially provided by a medical doctor.

I suspect the veggies has played a real part as my mother has had breast cancer 2x but not colon cancer and found via ful body scans. Assuming body scan can see deeper than skin deep. She is a big veggie eater. ( And lost extra pounds in her later years, almost to her trim size at her wedding.)

Veggies do matter. And I'm dropping pounds these days despite some veg and fruit. Proof that ketosis can be in play with limited veggies and fruit.

Interesting book. But given the review, missed the mark.

Last edited by Ms Arielle : Mon, Jul-12-21 at 13:31.
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  #283   ^
Old Tue, Jul-13-21, 05:11
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
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Posts: 14,684
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BawdyWench
I was very disappointed in Metabolical. ...

Sorry this was so long.


Don't be sorry! I so appreciate this review. Sounds like he's all over the map with rightness and utter wrongness.

Thank you, BawdyWench. I know you saved me from some blood pressure spikes
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  #284   ^
Old Tue, Jul-13-21, 05:41
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 14,684
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ms Arielle
...

Veggies do matter. And I'm dropping pounds these days despite some veg and fruit. Proof that ketosis can be in play with limited veggies and fruit.

Interesting book. But given the review, missed the mark.


As always, the saying goes, "The devil is in the details."

My constantly developing ideas on what works for me has been focused on my version of sandwiches: omelettes, or coconut or seaweed wraps. These have replaced low-carb wraps (gluten!) and I can't do salads, apparently (lectins!)

When I don't put vegetables on my "sandwiches" I do fine. Even with the coconut fiber. And when I drink "probiotic tea" (I like the Kevita brand) my digestion improves.

Also, tomorrow I'm supposed to get my mini-waffle maker. Then I'll be experimenting with chaffles, using ingredients I already know work for me.

Everything I've learned about myself so far contradicts so much of Metabolical I no longer plan to read it at all.

My Scribd app for the WIN. For the price of ONE book a month, I get LOTS of books/audiobooks.
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  #285   ^
Old Tue, Jul-13-21, 15:23
CMCM's Avatar
CMCM CMCM is offline
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Posts: 4,293
 
Plan: Keto / Atkins VLC
Stats: 173/148/135 Female 5'6"
BF:23.9
Progress: 66%
Location: N. Calif. Sierra Nevadas
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Thanks for the great and detailed review of Lustig's book, Bawdy. You've saved me the expense of buying it! Lustig is passionate about the evils of sugar and probably correct about that, but a lot of other things he says don't line up with my experience. I have his 2013 book Fat Chance, and I just dug it out to look at again and I think it has a lot of the same stuff in it as the new book, to be honest. And I realized when looking through it that a lot of that old book didn't especially resonate with me either, so I don't think I ever read it completely.

I've spent a lot of decades figuring out my own system and what works with it, and what doesn't. I can't really eat any grains, legumes, and quite a few vegetables don't agree with me (starchy veggies). However, while I love certain vegetables (doused in butter of course) and I eat salads every day with my meat, when I see someone pushing the fiber so much I start to tune out. I did my first Atkins diet in about 2003 and not long after I found out I have celiac disease. That explained why I felt so fantastic eating according to Dr. Atkins....no grains! I'm also very sugar sensitive, so while I tolerate moderate amounts of some fruits, I've always minimized them. Anyhow, I suppose Lustig wouldn't like the classic Atkins diet so much, but sorry Dr. Lustig, I love it and how it makes me feel. And I'm basically humming along in fantastic health as I'm about to turn 72, no meds, just vitamins.
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