I have heard that glucophage (the time release formula) doesn't cause stomach upset. I haven't taken it so someone else will have to speak to that. If you decide to take metformin, start at a very low dose in the middle of a meal. When you get to where you can tolerate that, you can slowly increase the dosage but always take it with a meal.
I found that the alpha lipoic acid must also be taken with a meal - not before the meal but after you have some food on your stomach.
Hope this helps!

The first time I took Metformin, I was sick the first couple of days...then I took it for 3 more weeks, with no problems.

Second time I took it, no problems from Day One, but BG fell 40 pts in 3 days. Doc says I am real suseptible to it (funny, since no ones seems to know how it works)

I will always have it on hand, in case I get ill, or have a bout of high Bg's that diet and exercise will not bring down. It worked extremely well for me. However, I do not want to have to worry about Hypos....Hypers are big enough worry for me.

BTW, my doc doesn't use Glucophage, says it is a different drug than Metformin...go figure.

Thanks Nopie and Sherrielee for the very useful advice. I think I will leave the ALA for a couple of days and then try and re-introduce it with larger meals than the breakfast one I was taking it with. Very intersting about the Metformin, maybe my sister is on the ole metformin and not the timed release ones. If the doctor decided to prescribe it I will certainly ask if he has that kind on prescription.

My sister refused to take any advice about low carb. I even sent her Dr Bernstein's book but she just sent it back and said it wouldn't suit her. Now she has gone from taking up to 14 metformin a day and another one 6 tablets and has progressed to insulin in very large doses. She tells me that she is gaining a stone a month in weight. She was a very large lady to start with so what she is now I dread to think. (We live at opposite ends of the country so don't get to meet up very often). It is such a shame because I know that low carb would work for her as it has for me.

However, as the old saying goes, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make it drink.

I am T1, 28years. Started ALA(1800mg/day), EPO(3000mg/day), Biotin(15mg/day) back in mid-august. I have always had trouble with morning fasting bg's, even with low carbing. They varied from 90-140, most of the time over 120, with a 30 point rise within the hour after 1st waking up. As Dr. B recommends I take a bolus apon 1st waking up (1 unit humalog) to prevent the 30 pt rise and extra above that (bg-90/45) to correct the elevated bg. I wanted to try the ALA and EPO to see if this would help lower my morning readings and lead to lower insulin requirements overall. The first 3 weeks I saw no improvement, as a matter of fact the fluctuations seemed to worsen and I was not feeling right. I was becoming very restsless at night (this is how I felt for years, before low carbing).
To make a long story a little shorter, I was about to give up on the ALA when flipping through Dr. B's book the last paragraph on page 161, of the new edition, caught my attention. It talks about the effects of large doses of Vitamin C. I have been taking 1000mgs of Vitamin C, at night, for over 7 years. Dr. B states that doses over 500mgs per day can raise bg's and that it becomes an oxident( rather than an anti-oxident) at doses over 500mgs. Needless to say I stopped the Vitamin C immediatley. The change has been dramatic. My total daily insulin requirements have dropped over 20%. I now only need a 1/2 unit of Humalog in the morning to prevent the 30 point rise in bg within the 1st hour of waking up. My morning bg's( apon 1st waking up) are now much more consistent (between 85-100, mostly in the 90's). Most importantly I feel normal again, my restlessness has gone away. I wake up at 6:30am every morning feeling total rested and much more energetic.
So after stopping the Vitamin C the ALA has help lower my insulin requiremnts throughout the day, and this has been most dramatic in the morning. Since I was not taking the time release Vitamin C I think its adverse effect on my system was happening through the nigh and into the next morning.
Mark

I was also taking about 1000 mgs of vitamin C but dropped back on the dosage after reading what Dr B had to say. I did this at the same time I started with the ALA/EPO . Bad science - now I can't say which thing has specifically helped me. But something sure has.
T2, diagnosed fall 2002, metformin, diet, exercise

I say this because Christine pointed out that if one puts on weight around the middle, it means you have more insulin circulating, when she said that I looked at my belt, realized I was using one less notch! Also was insanely hungry, which had not been a problem on bernstein. I think another evidence of excess insulin. I wish we could test for that the way we can our bg. Cheers, Bill[/QUOTE]
hi Bill:
it looks like for both of us ALA was completely negative experiment. my midsection has expanded too and I've gained weight too. o also felt restless, and couldn't sleep more than 6 hours at night, whcih i don't like. i had to drop ALA. it looks like it doesn't work for me. i also will try Dr.A induction for 2 weeks. now i need to lose almost 25 pounds thanks to ALA and probably too much alcohol lately. my fasting is still howering aropund 120 if I'm lucky. Dr.A diet is my last straw.
regards,
dina

Dina,that restless, can,t sleep feeling is the same as what i called "on edge,anxiety feelings".That started after about 3 days of excess energy and feeling on top of the world.For the first time in 2 years i started to wake up before 5am,just like on insulin.don,t want to go back to that ever again.

yes, christine. it was worst to get at 6AM saturday morning. today i was up at 4:30 AM, and still feed wired up. i'm not sure is it ALA or 15 mg of biotin kicking it as well. can high insulin make you restless too, i have no experience, i thought that high blood sugar can make you restless? anyway, now i'm so irritable from withdrawal probably. before, it was sort of ephoria. i wonder what it does if taken in larger doses?LOL
dina

There may be in a few years. In a recent issue of the Journal of the American Chemical Society (JACS, vol. 125, pp 8444-8445, 2003), researchers at New Mexico State University report that they have developed a new biochip device that simultaneously measures glucose and insulin concentrations. This is the initial report of such an assay, so there will still be a lot of feasibility tests and other developments before (and if) this reaches the market.

I am wondering, If Dr B says that ALA/EPO combo mimics Insulin...how are we to assume that it is not the ALA/EPO circulating (like Insulin) that is creating the same side effects (that you guys have described)? Including lower BG's? (for some of us.) Why do we just assume that it is Insulin and not the ALA/EPO combo? Just wondering!

I have been taking ALA for about one year, only 500mg per day. I am stopping at 1000 for now til I get some blood work done!

I get to finally see an ENDO next week. I have never been so excited to see a doctor...except when I was trying to get pregnant! LOL

thats the problem Sherrilee,i didn,t take ALA/EPO when i was injecting,and the symptoms i got then were the same as with the combo.my brain doesn,t distinguish between the two.it feels like excess insulin.

Hi Pepsi - Just thought you guys were assumingf it was INSULIN that was causing the effects described, instead of JUST ALA/EPO!

I quit the before bed dose, just take 500 ALA twice per day with 1000 EPO twice per day, still take 15mg Biotin. Getting good results. I am sleeping better now that I have dropped the bedtime dose. (Still have my toddy for that <wink>)

The lady at my Health Food store told me to quit taking the B12 (I had been taking it while on Metformin). She said excess B vitamins can result in hair loss. She also said that it takes 3 months for your body to adjust to that amount of ALA/EPO. Told me to keep her posted! She does have others on this dose...all Diabetics that had read Bernstein's book. So, she carries time-release! She has every Diabetic herbal remedy on the planet now and almost every low carb product on the market. Funny - she is a vegetarian! But, knows how to market products that are selling.

If it causes you to gain weight, it's got to be insulin at work and not the ALA/EPO. Dr. B states that this is the difference between them. ALA/EPO mimics only the glucose transport properties and not the fat production ones.

And I guess I was assuming that some were eating a bit more because they thought the ALA/EPO was covering it! I assumed this because I tried it myself, as you did Jim...with the Atkins Bars at 11pm. Didn't you use to eat NOTHING after dinner?

I really don't think that the ALA/EPO alone could cause weight gain...perhaps those other symptoms...restlesssness, more energy, etc. Just my humble opinion though!
Sherry

It can't. I don't think we're disagreeing here.

My point is this: if you're gaining weight after beginning ALA/EPO, it's not due to the ALA/EPO. It's due to increased insulin, and I don't believe that that is caused by the ALA/EPO either because Dr. Bernstein says it's not. There's got to be some other cause for that. Maybe a false sense of security in seeing rapid drops in fasting readings and some people getting careless and overdoing it with the evening snack. I WISH THESE DOCTORS OF OURS WOULD LET US MEASURE THE INSULIN WHEN WE DO THE HGBA1C TESTS. In many ways that's a more important test than the glucose. It would certainly put this discussion to bed.

BTW, I tried cutting back on the dosage to 300/500 every twelve hours and my fasting reading this morning was 95. I'm going back to the heavier dose. (600/1000 every twelve hours)

Jim