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  #31   ^
Old Fri, Mar-01-19, 05:42
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
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Posts: 14,673
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityGirl8
Dana Carpender did a write up on her Hold the Toast blog some years back, outlining the whole plan: The Original Weight Watchers Plan. She figured it was just under 100g carbs per day, but also pretty low calorie (about 1200).


Not actual low carb then, but maybe enough to make a difference.

The “diet plate” began in the Fifties: a leaf of lettuce, a bunless burger, a scoop of vottage cheese, and a peach slice or pineapple ring. Clear evidence people understood bread, pasta, and potatoes were fattening!

https://restaurant-ingthroughhistor...19/diet-plates/

I hear it over and over: “I lost weight as long as I stayed on it!” For me, calorie counting never worked that way. I would stall about ten pounds in, and no way could I continue suffering with no scale feedback.

Also, low carb is the only one I could stay on.

Last edited by WereBear : Fri, Mar-01-19 at 05:51.
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  #32   ^
Old Fri, Mar-01-19, 06:18
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,673
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CityGirl8
As I said, I do appreciate the good information DD has made available. But both companies provide information and support for people trying to lose weight for a subscription fee--and both claim that they're not really about weight loss, but about health. That doesn't make either one of them "bad." But I do think it's a bit disingenuous for DD to claim they're radically different than WW. What makes the two companies different is the diets they prescribe.


I would say they are radically different, and not just in the diets they prescribe. As someone with a web-based business myself, and also hate to be marketed to, I have discovered that "expecting everything for free" and being suspicious of anything that costs money can be an unthinking reflex.

The difference between rip-off artists and people selling guidance and expertise is in how well what they sell, works.
  • Stores have rent, websites have hosting fees and bandwidth. Popular sites pay a lot each month to stay open. I pay for this site, to avoid the ads and support the cause, but it really is one or the other.
  • Content doesn't generate itself, or put itself online. Someone is fussing with those pictures, formatting the stories, making sure they don't have typos, and figuring out ways of explaining the knowledge to all kinds of different people, with different learning styles. Now, a site is expected to have videos, podcast, ebooks; all available.
  • Yes, people sell things to make money, but it costs money to make these things. Another thread mentioned people who pay Virta Health hundreds of dollars to coach themselves through low carb for their diabetes because they can't do it for themselves. These are the people who WANT a system, which costs money.
  • It takes a lot of TIME. I put in easily another full time job on my site, and I had to start selling things or I couldn't keep "on the air." Popularity makes its own demands.
  • People want HELP: consultations, videos, plans, books, instructions. It takes time to make these, and the expert who does so should be compensated.
  • It also takes money and time to make a site work right and look good. Because if it is a mess with broken links and bad color schemes, no one will trust it. The message won't get through.

I once recommended GutSense.org and the response was, "But he sells things." Yes, he does, and part of it is because people demand it. They don't want to make their own decisions about which prebiotic, or read a bunch of blog posts and figure it out themselves. They want to BUY something that does some of the WORK for them, and there's nothing wrong with that.

My own fans want me to write books and outline step by step instructions, and we are working on our own Youtube channel where I can instruct visually.

Yes, it's all on my site for free, just like Diet Doctor, but people who want more can have more. They want it. And it costs money and time to give it to them.

WW makes you pay to play. And they don't teach you anything. You are dependent on them; their plans, their explanations, their pre-packaged foods and attendance at the meetings. But WW doesn't have people talking about how their health improved.

One is about dress sizes, and one is about getting your life back.
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  #33   ^
Old Fri, Mar-01-19, 07:19
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 5,304
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WereBear
I would say they are radically different, and not just in the diets they prescribe. As someone with a web-based business myself, and also hate to be marketed to, I have discovered that "expecting everything for free" and being suspicious of anything that costs money can be an unthinking reflex.



One is about dress sizes, and one is about getting your life back.


Great post. Time and money is expended by people who maintain websites. To assume that everyone can simply supply everything you want to know for free is to simply feel entitled to the fruits of someone's labor. Fair pricing for reliable information is not unethical.
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  #34   ^
Old Fri, Mar-01-19, 10:05
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,673
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
Great post. Time and money is expended by people who maintain websites. To assume that everyone can simply supply everything you want to know for free is to simply feel entitled to the fruits of someone's labor. Fair pricing for reliable information is not unethical.


I platonically love you, Jean
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  #35   ^
Old Fri, Mar-01-19, 10:44
CityGirl8 CityGirl8 is offline
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Posts: 856
 
Plan: Protein Power, IF
Stats: 238/204/145 Female 5'8"
BF:53.75%/46.6%/25%
Progress: 37%
Location: PNW
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
Great post. Time and money is expended by people who maintain websites. To assume that everyone can simply supply everything you want to know for free is to simply feel entitled to the fruits of someone's labor. Fair pricing for reliable information is not unethical.
I agree. I have no problem with asking people to pay for information and hard work that others have put in. And pay a fair price for it. People often woefully underestimate the time it takes someone else to produce work and what a reasonable "hourly" rate is for an experienced, educated professional.
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  #36   ^
Old Fri, Mar-01-19, 11:09
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 14,673
 
Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 129%
Location: USA
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by CityGirl8
I agree. I have no problem with asking people to pay for information and hard work that others have put in. And pay a fair price for it. People often woefully underestimate the time it takes someone else to produce work and what a reasonable "hourly" rate is for an experienced, educated professional.


And the pernicious attitude that they are doing US the favor by accepting our unpaid work as somehow it counts as publicity or exposure.

Similar to the ever-popular unpaid internships which favor the well-off and steal labor.
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