I saw Xena2005's Atkins BFL question but didn't want to hijack her thread. My question is the opposite of hers. I've been Atkins for 17 months and lost a total of 136 pounds. I've been cardio the whole time and started lifting in July of 03. I had to quit the lifting in Sept because of one of my kid's illness. I was pleased I lost 10 pounds during that month, but shocked by the body fat increase during that one month hiatus from the gym. I've been back in the gym lifting 3x for the past 3 weeks. My critical carb limit for losing on Atkins is over 70 net carbs but I've always kept it at 40-45 for weight loss speed, so I don't think needing more carbs will be a problem. And I already eat 5 times a day on my Atkins WOE so that won't be a problem.
I've done lots of research on the BFL eating plan and found that Bill Phillips in a series of articles in Muscle Media said he had altered his personal BFL eating plan to follow the ABCDE developers program of calorie/protein cycling for better muscle quality growth and was feeling stronger then ever. That was in 2001 and I haven't been able to find any updates to the BFL eating plans to reflect this nor any more articles in his mag as to if he continued on this. Does any one here have any info on this? I can fit the cal cycling in my Atkins very easily by using the AMR and BMR cal limits, but the protein cycling thing would be a real stretch moving me from OWL to maintenance in terms of the cal ratios. As a carboholic I need the appetite and craving control the Atkins deep ketosis gives me. Do ya'll get the craving and appetite suppression on your BFL eating plan or do you have to control it yourself with will power? How do you control yourself on that cheat day? I don't think I could do that and return to plan the next day.

I added the BFL pyramid intensity to my HIIT workouts a week ago and love the after workout feeling. I sort of did it to my weight lifting last night upping the weights 10 pounds for the 2nd set of all reps. I think I'm ready to fully embrace the BFL workout style. The not eating for fat burning isn't a problem since I was already doing that.

Oh yeah I bought the book and have already read it several times checking it out against my Atkins program. It has a 1999 copyright date is there a newer one?
I don't know if it will matter but I have Hashimoto's hypothyroidism too so the added protein maybe a problem there too, but my doctor said it was a life style decision and he would adjust my meds to fit my lifestyle.

Okay all you BFLers please let me know if A) I can do BFL workouts grow muscle and stay Atkins and B) do y'all know anything about the Cal/protein cycling
part of the BFL WOE. Thanks I promise I won't argue Atkins is better
Thanks

A) Yes, you can. Muscles fatigue more easily when you're in ketosis, but since you're used to lifting on a keto diet, that shouldn't be an issue. You might be more comfortable increasing carbs to your CCLL or even a bit beyond it (the intense workouts may allow you a few extra carbos). Or you might feel absolutely fine on 40/day. Everybody has a slightly different experience with it, apparently. For myself, I have to eat something with about 15 carbs immediately pre-workout, otherwise I "bonk" when lifting, and when that happened on a bench press with no spotter, it was really frightening--hence, the pre workout snack which I should have been doing all along anyway.

B) I don't know anything about Cal/protein cycling, but there are loads of better informed people on the BFL board. Someone will know.

Emily

That brings up an interesting question, because Bill Phillips does it, does that mean it's BFL? I don't think so. I think Bill wrote BFL for beginers, I wouldn't expect that he would be doing this himself for the rest of his life.

BTW, I haven't read anything about what Bill himself actually does for a workout or nutrition plan. But if you find anything more about this please let us know. It would certainly be an interesting read.


This is something I've been battling with. Since upping my carbs, I've been hungrier. I've just been dealing with it with mental tactics. Being able to eat frequently helps a lot. But I think that this is something that everyone on Atkins has to face at sometime. I don't think the good Dr. A. intended us to stay at induction levels for ever. I also try to stay away from foods that cause cravings.

For me, cheat days are days that I don't worry about 6 meals a day, and I allow myself some snack like an advantage bar or Pork Rinds. But I still stay on Atkins' on cheat days.
My wife has Thyroid problems too. It's been very rough on her. That Doctor of your sounds like a good one, I'd hang on to him/her.

It sounds like you're well on your way.

Arnie

here is the link to the article where Bill said he was doing it and gave an update on his progress.
http://www.musclemedia.com/training/abcde/v61_abc4.asp

Emily Thanks for the info. How does the pre work out carbs correspond with the working out before eating for better fat burning part of his program?

Arnie_g if the developer of a way of eating isn't following his own plan because he says he has found a better plan then wouldn't I want to follow the better eating plan? Those cravings you describe are want I want to avoid. I already am worried about the move to pre-maintenance in a few more pounds when the appetite suppression part of the deep ketosis is gone.

Thanks for the link, that is very interesting!

Yes, on the surface that would make sense. But, I didn't see where Bill said it is a better eating plan for beginners than "Eating for Life" is. Lets not forget that Bill is a pretty accomplished bodybuilder. What's right for Bill at this stage in his developement may not be right for those of us who are in our first year of working out. I would be surprised if Bill's weight routine looks anything like BFL, but again, that doesn't mean that a beginner should be doing what Bill is doing in the gym.

I don't mean to say you shouldn't do it. It's just my $.02 worth. If you do do give it a try, I'd wish you great success with it and would love to know how you doing with it.
The six meals a day help me a lot with this. Usually when I find myself getting hungry, it's only one more hour untill I can eat. I can always hang in there for just one hour.

Arnie