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  #46   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 11:13
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 13,016
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
Location: Ontario
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khrussva
Slightly off topic, but do any of you ever feel judgmental about successful low carbers who are quite knowledgeable about this WOE, yet they still end up finding the slippery slope only to regain some or all of the weight lost? I'm not talking about newbies just starting out nor people who have every intention of returning to "normal food" after reaching goal. I'm talking about those who have committed to making this a permanent lifestyle, yet end up regaining weight (whether it involves "cheating" or not). Someone like me, for example.



Hopefully critical rather than judgmental--most obvious example, Jimmy Moore. He did his version of nutritional ketosis for a full year. It worked, for a full year. Then he changed a bunch of stuff, and said, stress is making this not work any more. Keto doesn't work for me without a kitchen scale.

I'm not saying other stuff doesn't happen and that this approach will get everyone where they want to go, just that you can't be certain that something stopped working for somebody unless you're certain they kept doing the same thing, what justifies criticizing Jimmy Moore in this for me is that people might take this "experiment" as evidence against an approach that Jimmy hasn't applied consistently. I don't think he even has to cheat--for me, just not measuring my heavy cream can get me in trouble. I can easily eat 2000 calories or so a day, feel satisfied and not gain weight, but I can easily take in an extra cup of heavy cream in a day in my coffee, almost half again the calories, without feeling stuffed.
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  #47   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 12:05
dcc0455 dcc0455 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 157
 
Plan: Low Carb
Stats: 230/165/160 Male 67
BF:
Progress: 93%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teaser
Hopefully critical rather than judgmental--most obvious example, Jimmy Moore. He did his version of nutritional ketosis for a full year. It worked, for a full year. Then he changed a bunch of stuff, and said, stress is making this not work any more. .


I think I may have made the mistake of going down the same road as Jimmy, without the weight gain. What I mean by that is that after I hit my goal, I have experimented with IF, increased carbs, carb days, fast mimicking, etc. I now wonder if all of this experimenting was a bad idea. When I hit my goal and posted about maintenance, I had some replies suggesting to just continue eating as I had been, but I thought I need to develop a maintenance specific WOE. I probably should have listened to those recommending to keep doing what I knew worked.
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  #48   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 13:03
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 13,016
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
Location: Ontario
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That's another point--"same road as Jimmy, without the weight gain." If I slip up, and my meat intake goes up a little, I'm not rigorously measuring my heavy cream--I gain like, three pounds. I don't feel like my "sins" are any less than his, he just lives in a world where the consequences are much higher.

With the fasting etc.--yeah, I get into a place where I'm sort of playing Wile E. Coyote, trying to make something work, getting caught up in trying to make something work for me instead of concentrating on what has already worked for me. Sometimes I do come up with valuable additions, but a lot of the time I just don't know when to say okay, that's not for me.
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  #49   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 14:03
Liz53's Avatar
Liz53 Liz53 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 6,140
 
Plan: Mostly Fung/IDM
Stats: 165/138.4/135 Female 63
BF:???/better/???
Progress: 89%
Location: Washington state
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khrussva
Slightly off topic, but do any of you ever feel judgmental about successful low carbers who are quite knowledgeable about this WOE, yet they still end up finding the slippery slope only to regain some or all of the weight lost? I'm not talking about newbies just starting out nor people who have every intention of returning to "normal food" after reaching goal. I'm talking about those who have committed to making this a permanent lifestyle, yet end up regaining weight (whether it involves "cheating" or not). Someone like me, for example.



I absolutely do not judge those who may gain weight after losing a small amount or a substantial amount.

The only thing you can control is what you eat. Your body decides what to do with it. Teaser has posted studies that seem to indicate the dieted body is never the same as the never-dieted/maintained-normal-weight-over-the-years body and I've seen it in my life.

I have only respect for those who eat appropriately for their bodies (which for most of us is low carb) and keep on keeping on whether their body decides to maintain a loss or slowly put back the weight.

My experience tells me that you can eventually lose again, but it is never easy, and it probably gets more difficult each time you try.

Last edited by Liz53 : Thu, Mar-29-18 at 14:28.
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  #50   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 15:48
inflammabl's Avatar
inflammabl inflammabl is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,024
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 296/220/205 Male 71 inches
BF:25%?
Progress: 84%
Location: GSP and FLL
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It's easier to sin when you're sure you're right.
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  #51   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 16:02
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is online now
Senior Member
Posts: 4,181
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/128/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 106%
Location: Vermont
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Disdain is the feeling that someone is beneath contempt, unworthy of notice. Arrogance is a sense of superiority, being better than others. These two often go together. As a person who follows a lchf diet I may have superior knowledge and the ability to act on that knowledge, but instead of feeling disdain for people who eat high carb diets, especially ones filled with sugar and processed junk foods, I try to cultivate compassion for people who either do not know better or are unable to act on their knowledge for any of a variety of reasons. Truthfully, this is sometimes hard to do but neither arrogance or disdain have any chance of leading me towards beneficial actions whereas if I react with compassion there is some chance that I can be of benefit.
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  #52   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 16:17
Bonnie OFS Bonnie OFS is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,217
 
Plan: Dr. Bernstein
Stats: 188/175/135 Female 5 ft 4 inches
BF:
Progress: 25%
Location: NE WA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by khrussva
I'm exploring information about leptin resistance to see if there is a way for me to increase my satiety levels. It would be really nice if my body sent a clear message when I'd had enough to eat.


I hope you figure that out - then let me know! I can no longer safely make large meals with planned leftovers - by the time I'm done, there are no leftovers. I have to tell myself that that's it - no more food. I'm still hungry, but in about 30 minutes I'm less hungry & can ignore it.

And that's with eating good fats, protein, & low carb veggies.

edited to add - I just remembered something my mother told me. She grew up in a family of 6 kids, so when she cooked, she cooked for 8. When she married, she kept cooking for 8 - & somehow she & Daddy were able to eat a heck of a lot of it. She finally learned to cook for fewer people, but not by much. I don't remember the hungry years when money & food were in short supply, but I do remember the more prosperous years when there was more than enough food. That may be why I have a freezer chock full of meat & vegetables.

Last edited by Bonnie OFS : Thu, Mar-29-18 at 16:24.
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  #53   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 16:30
inflammabl's Avatar
inflammabl inflammabl is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,024
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 296/220/205 Male 71 inches
BF:25%?
Progress: 84%
Location: GSP and FLL
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
Disdain is the feeling that someone is beneath contempt, unworthy of notice. Arrogance is a sense of superiority, being better than others. These two often go together. As a person who follows a lchf diet I may have superior knowledge and the ability to act on that knowledge, but instead of feeling disdain for people who eat high carb diets, especially ones filled with sugar and processed junk foods, I try to cultivate compassion for people who either do not know better or are unable to act on their knowledge for any of a variety of reasons. Truthfully, this is sometimes hard to do but neither arrogance or disdain have any chance of leading me towards beneficial actions whereas if I react with compassion there is some chance that I can be of benefit.


Yes. There's a necessary difference in the definitions of sympathy and empathy. Empathy is much more persuasive than sympathy. I can be sympathetic towards someone without changing myself. I can't be empathetic towards someone without changing myself.
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  #54   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 22:26
robynsnest's Avatar
robynsnest robynsnest is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,146
 
Plan: Atkins
Stats: 336/286/199 Female 5'11"
BF:Losing it....
Progress: 36%
Location: Canada ay?
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Disdain for others?
How did I allow this to happen? Am I not educated or knowledgeable?
Having kicked other addictions, how is it I can't get a handle on this? Self medicate, hell ya, but how do I stop, all my other addictions I just stopped, I can't just stop eating
Shame and disappointment when you slip up or happen to loosen your resolve, don't cheat, EVER. Oooppps
Who can judge others when I judge myself?
Disdain for others, NO, just myself....
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  #55   ^
Old Thu, Mar-29-18, 23:21
Meme#1's Avatar
Meme#1 Meme#1 is online now
Posts: 9,347
 
Plan: Atkins DANDR
Stats: 210/188/160 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 44%
Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by robynsnest
Disdain for others?
How did I allow this to happen? Am I not educated or knowledgeable?
Having kicked other addictions, how is it I can't get a handle on this? Self medicate, hell ya, but how do I stop, all my other addictions I just stopped, I can't just stop eating
Shame and disappointment when you slip up or happen to loosen your resolve, don't cheat, EVER. Oooppps
Who can judge others when I judge myself?
Disdain for others, NO, just myself....


That was GREAT Robyn!!!
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  #56   ^
Old Fri, Mar-30-18, 10:19
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is online now
Posts: 2,415
 
Plan: Ketogenic (LCHFKD)
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teaser
That's another point--"same road as Jimmy, without the weight gain." If I slip up, and my meat intake goes up a little, I'm not rigorously measuring my heavy cream--I gain like, three pounds. I don't feel like my "sins" are any less than his, he just lives in a world where the consequences are much higher.

With the fasting etc.--yeah, I get into a place where I'm sort of playing Wile E. Coyote, trying to make something work, getting caught up in trying to make something work for me instead of concentrating on what has already worked for me. Sometimes I do come up with valuable additions, but a lot of the time I just don't know when to say okay, that's not for me.

This resonates very well with me at the moment. While I have been very consistent over the past 5 years, I tend to embrace other approaches to the point where I develop an understanding that they do or don't help me with nutritional and metabolic health. Developing a baseline that I can use as a solid foundation whenever I venture off path has become an anchor. Yes, it's interesting and educational to try different things. Knowing when and being able to grab the anchor line to pull back to the things that keep me healthy are the most important sources of knowledge for me.

Disdain? No, no one deserves to be judged in such a way. Everyone I know is making choices to do the best one can. Logic is that this attitude must be applied to all those I don't know as well.
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  #57   ^
Old Mon, Apr-02-18, 10:43
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is online now
Posts: 10,533
 
Plan: Epi-Paleo/IF
Stats: 220/161/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 84%
Location: USA
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It does not help that we are all dealing with a moving target. Because no one gets any younger

In the many years since starting low carbing, my initial success was excellent. But in the meantime I have fallen for carb scams like low carb pasta, dealt with a Menopause from Hell, endured a long and stubborn illness, and other life stresses.

What do I do when Im too sick to cook or when my job puts me on the road more often? Favorite restaurants change their catering menu and Im supposed to attend function there? And so forth.

We cant really set and forget no matter how much we think we should.
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  #58   ^
Old Mon, Apr-02-18, 14:23
Ms Arielle's Avatar
Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 9,027
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 247/217/153 Female 5'8"
BF:
Progress: 32%
Location: Massachusetts
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As far as distain for those that regain----I do not judge. I know personally how it happens.

This way of eating, LC ,is not as easy as taking a once a day pill. That method is socially acceptable, eating LC is rare and misunderstood out side this forum, in my experience. Trying to eat LC outside of my house is very challenging unless I am eating at a restaurant.

When boss changed my job from racing around to standing still, the pounds packed on. 10 hours standing in a cubicle is not like 20,ooo steps a day. ( Im guessing on the count), the 20 lbs that I kept off for years jumped on in two months. 200 became 220.

Then an injury that heals to the point of getting from kitchen to couch... another 20-25 piles on. When the pain kept me "bed ridden" the weigh stayed at 220.

Maintining goal weight is like a salmon fighting against the stream during spawning season...... many obstacles to over come....


I do get fustrated with a very over weight friend whose whole family eats crap free food and has all the ill effects of such. I sent him a number of inspiring utube videos and other sources of information to introduce there is a way to beat these ills. Weeks later when I talked to him to see if he had looked at the material... he had NOT. I am at the point of not wasting my time and heart on his decisions. I can lead a horse to water....... he almost died several months ago but still has his head in the sand. And his doctors keep him there.

Even my own family does not support my eating.... I know it works for me. THey accept vegan, but not LC.

Like many of us on this forum... Im on a lonely journey if not for this forum.

Last edited by Ms Arielle : Mon, Apr-02-18 at 14:43.
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  #59   ^
Old Mon, Apr-09-18, 19:59
NoBREAD NoBREAD is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 2,042
 
Plan: Keto/Low Carb
Stats: 170/120/100 Female 5ft.0in.
BF:
Progress: 71%
Location: WV Mountains
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I am a recovering junk food addict and binger who is normal sized. I played around off and on with low carb for years. I have only recently decided to get serious and eat low carb/keto for the rest of my life. So when I see overweight people I see it as an addiction and a merry-go-round. It's very hard to stop that cycle.

Sticking to this way of eating is a strong antidote for carb addictions.
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