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  #16   ^
Old Tue, Oct-14-14, 10:43
KDH's Avatar
KDH KDH is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,247
 
Plan: Atkins/Taubes
Stats: 270/168/160 Female 5'7"
BF:
Progress: 93%
Location: Dallas, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoWhammies
People get so entrenched in certain dietary lifestyles (including low-carb I believe) that to some, they begin to approach the dogma of religion. While I believe that a primal diet is the best way for me personally to eat - and for many other people - I also recognize and acknowledge that with how different we each are as biological identities, what works for me might not work for some.


I'll agree that it's easy to think "my way is the best way" and for the most part we all do, to varying degrees. I'll admit it bothers the hell out of me when I see somebody obviously failing at the SAD or granatarian (vegetarian? ha.) diets or whatever. And obviously it shouldn't, because it's not my business and has nothing to do with me. Just like seeing somebody in a really ugly outfit, it bothers me, and it shouldn't. But if somebody is thriving, I wouldn't think past "hmm, curious, opposite of me" and move on.

However, when you add in an attitude of not only scientific but MORAL superiority, and are dealing with people who obviously think they are saving the world because they don't eat meat? It goes WAY beyond any normal "you're not doing it right!" attitudes. I have often thought that vegans aren't really hypocritical, they really do think a diet that encourages ill health and infertility is best for the world. Since humans are the scum of the planet and need to be wiped out, so that we can have sunshine and rainbows and Mother Nature will be peaceful and blissful once more. With unicorns. Those are important.
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  #17   ^
Old Tue, Oct-14-14, 10:57
KDH's Avatar
KDH KDH is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,247
 
Plan: Atkins/Taubes
Stats: 270/168/160 Female 5'7"
BF:
Progress: 93%
Location: Dallas, TX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aj_cohn

Then there's the long-term effects:
  • Hair falling out in clumps
  • Feeling cold all the time
  • Granuloma annulare
  • Systemic inflammation from the gliadin causing the tight junctions to open and all sorts of stuff leaving the lumen, not to mention the problems of wheat germ agglutinin.
  • increased risk of heart disease from high triglycerides
  • increased risk of NAFLD from too much fruit
  • dental-health nightmares (the lack of Vit. K again)

The list goes on and on.

The only way forward with a vegan diet is to eat animal products.


I saw a video from that crazy banana eating woman on youtube once, she was bragging about how she stopped her period with her diet. Uh... that's not really a good thing. Not sure how she "knows" it's not amenorrhea. It's just, um... some other (healthy) reason your body isn't functioning like a healthy female? Would hair falling out be good to make more room for wigs? Very confused people here.

I was at Sprouts yesterday and the cover of Vegan Times (or whatever vegan magazine, can't exactly remember) was great. It was the "weightlifting edition" with a couple on the cover. "busting the myths!" There was ZERO muscle definition on the woman. I probably have more. Had to look twice because of all the tattoos, but nope, nothing. Just skinny. The guy looked ok, but made me laugh because he had that pose with his arms crossed, fists tucked under his biceps to bulge them out as much as possible. I mean, come ON. And they were both pretty pale. Not healthy pink-cheeked porcelain princess pale, but sallow. But they love animals, so I guess it's worth it.
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  #18   ^
Old Tue, Oct-14-14, 13:54
bkloots's Avatar
bkloots bkloots is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 10,151
 
Plan: LC--Atkins
Stats: 195/160/150 Female 62in
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: Kansas City, MO
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Quote:
The first Atkins Diet book was published in 1972; since then well-informed people have come to understand (through their own readings and personal experiences) that eating an animal-based, high-fat, low-carbohydrate diet is wrong. They have learned that following this eating pattern causes epidemic diseases, including type-2 diabetes, coronary heart disease, and common cancers; and that the livestock industry is at the root of climate change. Many people are also wrestling with their conscience as they deal with the moral issues of animals being killed unnecessarily for food, supporting the horrors of factory farming, and depleting our oceans. Therefore, a diet book titled Eat More Animals to Lose Weight would meet a mostly unfriendly audience.
Yes, I'm wrestling with my conscience right now as I mix up the marinade for these pork chops. Clearly, I'll be dead soon anyway, what with the diabetes, coronary disease, and cancer.

Y'know, I thought Wheat Belly was a fine read. Atkins, too. But people who sell books have a vested interest in making sensational claims. So "well-informed" people should make sure they do their homework on everything and everybody.

Meanwhile, I'm inventing a device to catch cow farts and thus reverse global warming. Wanna buy in?
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  #19   ^
Old Tue, Oct-14-14, 14:38
bkloots's Avatar
bkloots bkloots is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 10,151
 
Plan: LC--Atkins
Stats: 195/160/150 Female 62in
BF:
Progress: 78%
Location: Kansas City, MO
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Quote:
People want a one-size fits all approach. They want a definitive way of eating that will confer health (or weight loss), and I don't believe it exists. For true health, people need to find that perfect combination of elements that fits them.


Now that I've listened to (most of) the interview with Jimmie Moore, I find that McDougall does indeed believe in a diet that ALL human beings should eat for optimal health. Of course, that would be his starch diet.

While we all want an alternative to the nasty SAD, once you eliminate modern scourges like sugar, white flour, and various chemical ingredients, there are many possible dietary approaches that can be healthy.

Fresh food is a good start for most.
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  #20   ^
Old Sat, Feb-21-15, 02:22
TempleHall TempleHall is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 152
 
Plan: none
Stats: 184/182/155 Male 5'9"
BF:26%
Progress: 7%
Location: SC, USA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teaser

As far as more whole grain bread being protective--I believe Davis has compared whole grain bread to filtered cigarettes. Slightly less bad.
FWIW, filtered cigarettes are not slightly less bad. Some nicotine is filtered but the typical smoker then wants more cigarettes than if unfiltered so the end result is the same.
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  #21   ^
Old Sat, Feb-21-15, 02:55
deandean deandean is offline
Registered Member
Posts: 61
 
Plan: Primal starting 2014
Stats: 269.7/233.1/175 Male 6'
BF:
Progress: 39%
Location: Southern Alberta
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[

However, when you add in an attitude of not only scientific but MORAL superiority, and are dealing with people who obviously think they are saving the world because they don't eat meat?


Most of the veggies/fruit you can buy here is imported. Our growing season is short. Meat is easy to find that was raised local. I am all for saving the planet BUT what about all the fuel used to get fruits and veggies here? Last time I checked burning fossil fuel was bad for the environment.

FWIW, Darn near every vegan/vegetarian I have met is in worse health than I am.
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  #22   ^
Old Sat, Feb-21-15, 03:01
ojoj's Avatar
ojoj ojoj is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 3,184
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 210/126/127 Female 5ft 7in
BF:
Progress: 101%
Location: South of England
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Bless him, he's just protecting his interests. But his way doesnt work for me, nor in my mind is it correct - but hey, he can keep fighting a losing battle lol. Its just a shame that there are people out there who dont try the alternatives and give it a chance, afterall, I tried low fat high carb and it ruined the best part of my life.



Jo xxx
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  #23   ^
Old Sat, Feb-21-15, 11:44
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,044
 
Plan: Very LC, Higher Protein
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoWhammies
So while I know we can make broad assumptions about certain dietary guidelines based on the outcomes of research, I do believe there is a ton of room for working within one's body's restrictions and allowances. I think that's what makes nutrition so difficult and why so many people - even "experts" - just flat out get it wrong. People want a one-size fits all approach. They want a definitive way of eating that will confer health (or weight loss), and I don't believe it exists. For true health, people need to find that perfect combination of elements that fits them.

Extremely important statements to understand. Given the lack of knowledge about nutrition specifically related to what's best for individual phenotypes, we're left with the responsibility of understanding what works best. Many times, it requires experimentation with food to determine how the individual reacts.
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