I wrote to the food administration for NZ and Ausi last week asking them about the fibre business for us folks down under .
Thought you may be interested in his reply much of which was not a suprise, but I did find out what I wanted to know.

Sent: Friday, 29 March 2002 20:53
To: Information Officer
Subject: Question about Fibre

Hi,
I am a New Zealander and am hoping you can clear up my
confusion.
I am on a low carb way of eating and have been told I
can eat high fibre carb foods such as crude bran and ground linseed and subtract all the fibre leaving me with a very low carb product.
This would also dispel many of the calories too of
course?
This is supposedly because the fibre is not digested.
I wonder if the fibre is included in the carb grams to
begin with or whether it is counted separately?
It is an American website that is quoting their food
info that has told me this and I'm not sure if there food labels are
like ours.
It seems to be too good to be true and I am hoping you
can enlighten me.
There are other Australians and New Zealanders at this
website subtracting fibre but I am being very cautious.
Hoping you can clarify this for me and I can pass it on.

I have searched the net and you seem to have the answer
but its not clear enough for me in layman's terms

yours sincerely
Jenny Honeycombe
........................................................................ ................................
Dear Jenny

Firstly, I am not sure why you are on a low carb eating
plan but I would not advocate this is a healthy eating plan. Whilst low
carbohydrate diets can be successful in helping people to loose weight
this will only occur if the total calories you are consuming is less
than what you are using up. For example: the zone diet which advocates
a 30/30/40 eating plan does not help clients to lose weight because of a
reduction in carbohydrates it does because of a reduction in calories.
In the zone diet you are required to eat 1.8g/ -2.2g of protein per
kilogram of bodyweight. When you calculate the percentage of energy
from the other nutrients what you get is basically a low calorie diet.
Example: 60 kg person
Protein 2g/kg 102grams at 4 calories per gram equals 408
calories If this is 30% of energy intake you are talking about a 1100
calories per day diet (very low).

There are numerous reasons why these diets are not
recommended which include :

-protein foods are often high in fat and saturated fat
and can increase blood cholesterol levels if consumed in high amounts;
-it is too difficult to sustain a low carb eating plan
for a sustained period;
-too few carbohydrates will see the body develop ketones
which cause bad breath and can make a person feel lethargic;
-large amounts of protein can place stress on the
kidneys as the body basically oxidises excess protein not used for
growth and repair of tissue.

You are correct that in the calculation of carbohydrate in grams, fibre is not included. However fibre does yield energy through microbiological fermentation in the large colon which produces short chain fatty acids that are absorbed into the body.
Fibre yields 8kJ/g energy as opposed to 17kJ/g energy for carbohydrate.
Therefore whilst fibre would not be included in the carbohydrate grams the energy would be included in the total energy of the food.

High fibre foods are advocated as important component of maintaining a healthy diet and I would encourage you to consume these foods. They make you feel satisfied and generally high fibre foods are low in fat, rich in vitamins and minerals. High fibre diets have been shown to protect against numerous diseases including cancer of the bowel etc.

If you would like to discuss the issue of low carb diets further please don't hesitate to phone me on (02) 6271 2687.

Yours sincerely

Andrew McCormack
Nutritionist
ANZFA

Hi,

The tides are slowly turning - but nutritionalilsts who have been brainwahed with the 'healthy food pyraid' will take a long time to come to terms with our WOL.

My dietitian is trying to do something about it. She is from NZ originally now in Aus. She thinks the pyramid should be turned on its head and goes to nutritional conventions etc - things are slowly changing she says. Also my Doctor is happy for me to be locarbing.

While it may not be the healthiest diet - my physio says - obesity is not healthy either - so agrees with the lesser of 2 evils - locarbing.

Did you know that the traditonal food puyramid is exactly what farmers feed pigs to fattenthem up???

Interesting - and worth pondering.

Good Luck - I take it you won't be taking up his offer to talk further on the matter ???

Good luck

Wendye

Nah, I wont be ringing him, he will just 'know' that he is the expert I wasnt suprised by his approach and mind set it was the fibre I wanted to know about and got my answer there.

Interesting about the pigs diet, I will keep that in mind, thanks

Well Well Some people really don't like the LC way my Dr is happy with it has reduced my colesterol so that has me won...

I'd love to ask him would it be more preferable if I continued suffering from the diabetes, which low-carbing has cured.

When will they ever learn!

Couldn't resist making a comment on the "pig diet" comment. When my husband was young his family were on a dairy farm and raised pigs as well to sell as "baconers"

It was always necessary to feed them a high protein diet to ensure that the pigs developed muscle and not FAT.

The pigs were fed dairy products and high protein supplements as well as some whole grain foods. If they weren't fed properly, they had lots and lots of wobbly fat and a low yield of meat for bacon.

Has anyone noticed the vast quantity of bacon with more fat than meat? I think the pig producers need to look at the quantity of carbs they are feeding their pigs and think about more protein!

Isn't it also interesting that the carbs are the cheap end of the feed scale?

Gemma

Thats very interesting Gemma, I wonder if the pigs put on weight with the plenty of protein approach as they would on higher carbs? Did fat come into the equation do you know.

I believe I am closley related to the pig family

Attached Images

pigfly.gif (13.5 KB, 72 views)

I loved the flying pig - I think I'm closely related too!

Yes, the pigs put on muscle weight really fast on the higher protein diet. They grow really fast and once they were weaned they still had the high protein foods supplied by dairy prods etc, then they fed them hard grains for a week or two to "harden" them up - but too much poor qual carb - like white bread - this was back in the days of "swill" feeding which is no longer allowed - instead of whey which was one of the main products pigs were fed then, kept the fat "wobbly" and lessened the size of the muscle. Nowadays they use ultrasound to check for eye muscle size and fat depth - interesting isn't it - don't think I want anyone checking my fat depth with an ultrasound!

By the way, I use one of the psyllium products with the orange flavour - not metamucil - the other one available in Woolies and Coles. It isn't as sickly or "orangey" as metamucil. Don't like the unflavoured ones though.

ALSO, used to buy BENEFIBRE made in Victoria by Novartis from the health food section in Woolies but they seem to have stopped selling it. It is made of guar gum and was terrific - completely clear and tasteless so could be added to coffee or anything - can't believe that so often when you find something good - they stop selling it. I am going to ring Novartis on their toll free line and find out where else it is sold! It is also supposed to be the best fibre for lowering LDL cholesterol!!

Gemma

Thanks for all that info. we live on a sheep and cattle station , my husband used to be interested in the idea of pig farming but hasnt mentioned it in years, I think it was half because he was a mad keen pighunter.
I actually dont like pork much at all and the new bacons with hardly any fat dont go so crispy as the other stuff does and they have that taste I dont like. Give me the fatty stuff
WE raised a pig to eat once but then i couldnt bear to eat it

Hi Bloom

No wonder you couldn't eat one you raised! Nothing worse than killing off a friend! Remember Babe?

Tell me about the station? Where are you located? We have a small cattle stud (Poll Hereford) here in Victoria. I don't mind killing off the ones I don't know "personally" but have big reservations about eating one I know.

My parents had sheep and cattle when I was young and we always had pet lambs - we didn't eat them either.

We have a pet emu and people always say what a great roast it would make but as far as we are concerned, he is part of the family - and anyway he doesn't eat much so we don't mind having him around!

I also have chooks and they will die of old age rather than the axe as they are my insect, slug and snail killers! They roam the garden and do a great job. Only downside is when they drop dollops on the paths!

Bye now

Gemma

Hi again Gemma,
I have had chooks and ducks too and there sure are great at demolishing the bugs. When we moved in here there was no grounds or garden, house was still in the paddock. I planted and it was eaten we had sooo many creepy crawlies. I had never seen so many slaters in my life , millions it seemed. The chooks got rid of them all eventually and also as trees grew birds came and they keep them at bay too.
I started breeding golden Retrievers about 5 years ago and the chooks and ducks had to go as the dogs would kill them as they are natural duck dogs.
I also made a fish pond and the ducks were a total pain in that. I do still miss there bobbibg heads though and i would like some frizzle bantams but well maybe one day. I dont like to pen things up all the time so im hard to please.
I have 4 dogs and Nick has 6 farm dogs.
We dont own this block, Nick is the head shepherd and we have been here 18 years. Its north of Auckland on the west coast and also the kaipara harbour. Its 7,000 acres.
Our kids had pet lambs too when they were younger and I used to spin so made them jumpers form the first shear from their lambs.
Lisa's lamb Sam always remained very tame he was a wether so we didnt put him back with the others like we did with the ewe lambs, they stayed on the farm but went back with all the others and lost there personality. Sam would always 'answer' if you called out to him and he would run to have a cuddle ot scratch when called and tear upo the fence line when we came home. Sheep are not so dumb afterall. He lived till he was 9.
We have a kunekune pig that is big and fat and ha had a couple of litters. She is extremily tame to but she is stictly in the paddock.
Some people even have them in the house , no way .
There's lots of wild fallow deer out in the forest that runs along the coast and Nick is a keen hunter and fiherman on the harbour so Im lucky cos I get as much free protein as I can eat

well now you know far more than you wanted so I'll leave it at that
Whats the Emu like .does it bite at all. id love geese but have met soem mighty nasty ones that put me off. Lots of peacocks here but not near the house.
Gosh I said I was going , listen to me
Jenny