World's shortest description of everything you can do to lose weight... : General Low-Carb Forum : Active Low-Carber Forums

#31 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 03:11

Unfinished Unfinished is offline

Registered Member

Posts: 36

Plan: Carnivore
Stats: 236/217/185 Female 69 inches

BF:
Progress: 37%

Location: Oregon

Quote:

That's what I'm talking about. It's not about persistence or willpower. We have been led to believe it is, but it's really not. It's quite simply about eating the proper diet for the human race, then there is no need for artificial persistence or willpower. You just listen to your body. When you are hungry you eat. It can't be simpler.

Patrick, I could'nt have said it better. My experience has certainly been that not until I got my foods right did it all become simple.

Quote:

Your story could be my story. Let me see if I have this right. The difference between LC/Atkins and PaNu from a ***food*** standpoint is:

1. No AS
2. No alcohol
3. No veggies
4. No oils from veggies/seeds
5. No nuts
6. No legumes
7. No caffine

Did I miss anything?

Tapestry, Dr. Harris’ PaNu diet, as I’ve interpreted it, is to eliminates sugars (including fructose), legumes, and grains. It adjusts omega 6s and 3s by relying on animal fats and eliminating PUFAs. It prescribes intermittent fasting, weight and interval training, and proper amounts of vit D. And should dairy be a problem then it, too, should be eliminated. As Patrick points out, veggies are optional and that he believes moderate alcohol can be consumed. He says that this is the proper human diet and that it should lead to optimal health. But for those like myself who need to lose weight and find They’re unable to do so with the above steps, he suggests eating only the minimum necessary protein (.8 -1 g/Kg/d) and the rest as fat (80-85 %) with say, only 5 % carbs. Elsewhere he says that it’s helpful to completely avoid the taste of anything sweet, natural or artificial and I have chosen to avoid all alcohol whilst needing to lose weight. I think this sounds close to what you're doing. How is it working for you?

Quote:

Unlike many denizens of the LC crowd, you seem to be an extemely open-minded person. There are others here and on the Web who have fixed views which they feel are "essential" for all to follow. Ridiculous.... I'm tired of the holier than thou insistence by the "annointed" that they have a prescription for the ideal diet for mankind.

Abby, wow. I’ve spent years seeking improved health and I can assure you that it’s been my very open mind that has led me on this journey and to this regime and the astounding changes in health that I’ve seen recently. And even a cursory look at Patrick's journey indicates he's utilized a very open-minded approach.

Cheryl

Last edited by Unfinished : Sun, Sep-27-09 at 05:18.

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#32 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 03:20

Unfinished Unfinished is offline

Registered Member

Posts: 36

Plan: Carnivore
Stats: 236/217/185 Female 69 inches

BF:
Progress: 37%

Location: Oregon

Citruskiss, your weight-loss results are great (looks like we began our jouneys at the same weight). I'm curious whether or not you've been relatively in line with these basic principles for most of your weight loss.

Cheryl

Last edited by Unfinished : Sun, Sep-27-09 at 05:18.

#33 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 07:08

LustFTM

LUST For The Moment

Posts: 271

Plan: LC/VLC
Stats: 167/139/137 Female 5'7"

BF:5'7"
Progress: 93%

Location: BOSTON

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unfinished

And even a cursory look at Patrick's journey indicates he's utilized a very open-minded approach.

Cheryl

Cheryl, I wasn't referring to Patrick. I was speaking more about the host of Web and book authoritarians who proclaim that it's their way........or the highway......

Last edited by LustFTM : Sun, Sep-27-09 at 11:03.

#34 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 08:09

Unfinished Unfinished is offline

Registered Member

Posts: 36

Plan: Carnivore
Stats: 236/217/185 Female 69 inches

BF:
Progress: 37%

Location: Oregon

Thanks for clearing that up, Abby, I'd misunderstood. And I would agree with you that different people can lose weight by following different diets. After all, the states of our individual metabolisms vary greatly. But, at the very least I've come to believe that an optimum diet for good health can be stated as follows:

http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/...ng-reasons.html

Quote:

PaNu is proscriptive (don't eat that food!) because the way to the EM2 is to avoid the neolithic agents of wheat, linoleic acid and fructose, not through duplicating a particular dietary composition from the paleolithic period - there was too much variety to even do that, and much of what I read about what paleo man ate is pure conjecture if not paleofantasy.

What I've personally experienced is that by avoiding the above foods, and adhering to the macro-nutrient ratios that Dr. Harris suggests (for weight-loss with broken metabolisms) I no longer need to call on will-power. Don't need it, don't want it. There is no effort required. I'm stunned, but my body appears to have taken over this healing process.

What I will give you, however, is that it took more will-power than I care to remember, to make my way this point

Cheryl

#35 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 09:05

Valtor

Senior Member

Posts: 2,036

Plan: VLC 4 days a week
Stats: 337/258/200 Male 6' 1"

BF:
Progress: 58%

Location: Québec, Canada

http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/...oil-or-not.html
http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/.../vitamin-d.html

Quote:

Let's start with some terms. Let's call an artificial or synthesized substance that we consume in addition to food a drug, and a more or less "natural" substance in artificially concentrated amounts a supplement.

It should be obvious by now that I generally don't believe in drugs or supplements. If you are deficient in a substance that you are not getting in your diet or that your body would normally manufacture but doesn't, that is replacement. Examples: a 35 year old woman who is hypothyroid due to autoimmune disease from eating wheat needs to take synthroid; a 42 year old woman has premature menopause from a lifetime of hyperinsulinism and uses hormone replacement therapy; a Naval officer does a three month underwater tour on a nuclear submarine and takes vitamin D to compensate for his deficit of normal Vit D production caused by lack of exposure to UVB from sunlight.

If one eats properly in a manner to which we are adapted, the law of unintended consequences would dictate that introducing extra amounts of any specific substance, whether a "natural" micronutrient, a "vitamin" or a big pharma drug developed in a laboratory, is more likely to do harm than good, the same way randomly adding a part to a piece of carefully designed machinery is more likely to screw it up than improve it.

It looks like most of us only need to take 4000 to 8000 UI of Vitamin D per day, that's replacement. The rest would be supplements. Interesting take on this.

Patrick

#36 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 11:10

Valtor

Senior Member

Posts: 2,036

Plan: VLC 4 days a week
Stats: 337/258/200 Male 6' 1"

BF:
Progress: 58%

Location: Québec, Canada

http://www.paleonu.com/panu-weblog/...eals-a-day.html

Quote:

Step 6 is a cultural counterweight to all the stupid advice you see about "frequent healthy snacks" in the mainstream media. We are told to eat frequent snacks because the standard american diet with 55% carbs has you metabolically and emotionally tethered to frequent boluses of glucose.

Go watch a kid's soccer game- they can't play for 15 minutes without a break for cookies or corn-syrup-laden juice boxes or gatorade - our children are sugar junkies and the advice to eat frequently is just advice to not stray too far from your dealer so you can get a fix when your blood sugar starts to crash!

So I agree with Gary Taubes that we should listen to our bodies, but only after we have kicked the cocaine, the alcohol, the cigarettes the sugar, and the cereals.

Otherwise our bodies are likely to tell us we need something that is not good for us.

So on this WOE, infrequent meals should come naturally. It's not really Intermittent Fasting. You just naturally eat less often.

Patrick

#37 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 11:27

Citruskiss Citruskiss is offline

I've decided

Posts: 16,864

Plan: LC
Stats: 235/137.6/130 Female 5' 5"

BF:haven't a clue
Progress: 93%

Is there a huge difference between two meals and three meals?

Typical day for me:

Breakfast - more protein and fat heavy - sausage and eggs, that kind of thing

Lunch - salad with small amount of protein (2-4 ounces max) - greens, cucumbers, green onion ends, some leftover roasted chicken or some salmon or something, homemade dressing.

Dinner - protein and vegetable - typical is baked salmon with roasted asparagus.

If I skip lunch, then I overeat at dinner. Happens to me every time. My lunches are fairly light though, in comparison to my breakfast meal. Big breakfast, light-ish lunch, light-ish dinner.

What is the benefit of going to just two meals per day? I don't feel like I need more than three meals, and snacks are pretty rare. Why is it necessary to go to fewer meals?

I'm just kind of curious about this one. Is he saying that we'll just naturally eat less often? Not really saying we need to keep it to two meals or less?

#38 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 11:34

Valtor

Senior Member

Posts: 2,036

Plan: VLC 4 days a week
Stats: 337/258/200 Male 6' 1"

BF:
Progress: 58%

Location: Québec, Canada

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citruskiss

...Is he saying that we'll just naturally eat less often? Not really saying we need to keep it to two meals or less?

That's right. So if you are hungry for 3 meals, then 3 meals is what you need. Personally, when I eat VLC, I'm not hungry for more than 2 meals.

But what is important, is to not be hungry. If you eat only when you are hungry, but still gain weight, that would mean you are not eating what is right for you.

Patrick

#39 ^

Sun, Sep-27-09, 15:30

tiredangel tiredangel is offline

Senior Member

Posts: 1,110

Plan: Carnivore
Stats: 235/175/150 Female 5'7"

BF:
Progress: 71%

I'm eating two meals a day at this point, and I'm losing weight like crazy even though my carbs are probably up to 50 - 75 per day (I'm eating potatoes while they're in season and winter squash). I skip breakfast. I do eat a good sized lunch and a huge dinner, and my food tastes SO good this way. Hunger is great to make food taste better.

I think the grazing that is recommended by so many actually causes people to take in far more calories than they would if they only ate two good meals. I'm sure I take in fewer calories than I did when I ate three moderate sized meals as well. Breakfast is easy for me to skip, though.

I can't get over how much weight I'm losing now. I'm eating a lot of protein and fat, so I'm hoping I'm not losing muscle doing this. My weightloss has also sped up since adding the carbs. That doesn't make much sense to me, but I'll stick with this until my weight loss slows, then I'll switch back to VLC again.

#40 ^

Mon, Sep-28-09, 01:31

mike_d

Grease is the word!

Posts: 8,475

Plan: PSMF/IF
Stats: 236/181/180 Male 72 inches

BF:disappearing!
Progress: 98%

Location: Alamo city, Texas

Quote:

Originally Posted by tiredangel

I skip breakfast. I do eat a good sized lunch and a huge dinner, and my food tastes SO good this way. Hunger is great to make food taste better.

That to me is one of the best benefits of fasting, plus I have more energy for working when I eat less often. I too, end up enjoying both the fasting and the break~fasting

True, anyone can lose weight on most any plan, but I think the number of plans that also bestow a lifetime of radiant health and youth can be counted on one hand.

#41 ^

Mon, Sep-28-09, 01:34

mike_d

Grease is the word!

Posts: 8,475

Plan: PSMF/IF
Stats: 236/181/180 Male 72 inches

BF:disappearing!
Progress: 98%

Location: Alamo city, Texas

a duplicated post

Last edited by mike_d : Mon, Sep-28-09 at 01:39. Reason: server stopped?

#42 ^

Mon, Sep-28-09, 11:21

Hilary M

Diet Cokeaholic

Posts: 15,793

Plan: Whole foods moderation
Stats: 221/215/150 Female 5 feet 4 inches

BF:
Progress: 8%

Location: Alabama

Quote:

Originally Posted by Valtor

It looks like most of us only need to take 4000 to 8000 UI of Vitamin D per day, that's replacement. The rest would be supplements.

Is there a way to tell how much an individual needs? 4000 to 8000 is a pretty big swing. I'm currently taking 4700 UI a day; how do I know if I need more and if I start taking 8000 a day out of a pure random guess, but my body doesn't need that much, is it harmful?

#43 ^

Mon, Sep-28-09, 14:52

LustFTM

LUST For The Moment

Posts: 271

Plan: LC/VLC
Stats: 167/139/137 Female 5'7"

BF:5'7"
Progress: 93%

Location: BOSTON

Quote:

Is there a way to tell how much an individual needs?

Yes. Vitamin D blood levels are available. They'll at least show whether or not you're in a toxic range............

#44 ^

Mon, Sep-28-09, 15:07

Nancy LC

Experimenter

Posts: 25,887

Plan: DDF
Stats: 202/185.4/179 Female 67

BF:
Progress: 72%

Location: San Diego, CA

They've given people 10,000 iu for years on end and never had a toxic problem. If I were just starting out supplementing I'd probably do 5,000 iu a day for 3 months then test, adjust afterwards.

#45 ^

Mon, Sep-28-09, 15:30

PilotGal

Registered Member

Posts: 36,355

Plan: KetoCarnivore
Stats: 206.6/178/160 Female 5'7

BF:awesome
Progress: 61%

Location: USA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Unfinished

OK, I have to share. I’ve been following Dr. Harris’ PaNu since the beginning of August when I stumbled upon his Blog... and his recommendations for weight-loss (with no artificial sweeteners or alcohol) since he posted them. I’ve been LC for over 8 years now with good weight loss (although I could never approach goal) until I began adding the occasional high carb treat. Over the past 3 years I’ve put on weight and have been strictly LC again since January this year with no weight loss. Until PaNu. I just can not believe what’s happening to my body. The inches are melting away, I'm down 12 pounds, my brain fog is gone, my constant fatigue is gone, I am bursting with energy and my mood in vastly improved. My gout has disappeared, the numb areas (I know, this sounds crazy) that I’ve had on my thighs since adolescence have regained sensation, my skin is so soft it feels lathered in skin cream. I have no cravings and almost no appetite though when I do eat I enjoy it. It’s as though I’ve finally, at 55 years of age, developed a normal relationship with food. I finally know the difference between hunger and cravings. I used to be completely baffled by the common advice to simply “stop eating when you’re full”. Full? I have never known what that was. I thought it meant a stuffed belly… which mine often was… but the desire, the craving, for food was always present. On PaNu, a switch absolutely flips at a certain point in each meal and, man, I can not eat another bite. My fasting has gradually grown to 18 hours a day, and most days now my body only wants to eat 1 meal (late afternoon) and then I’ll sip a cup or two of rich bone broth for the nutrients. I’m flabbergasted. I believe that everything Dr. Harris has mentioned is essential to the results I’m experiencing. I keep my protein moderate (from 60 to 70 grams), then my fat at over 80%, and no carbs from vegetable sources except the occasional avocado. I drink heavy cream and use butter (both raw) but no other dairy until I get my food intolerance lab results back from Enterolab. Even then I’ll be very cautious about adding cheese back in. I love it and that makes me wary.

So, for the first time ever, I am absolutely confident that my body is healing itself and will attain it’s proper weight. And I’m astounded that I can say that.

this is my story, as well and i'm a 54 yr old woman.. i have described many things that have healed on my body since eating this way.. i am a Carnivore.