Thanks for your reply. I do eat nuts (for snacks) and fat - which I never did for years. I will cut back and see waht happens. I do drink alot of water, but have even cut back on that as it tends to bloat me. I exercise regularly, last summer I swam, then in the fall started walking, which I will start again as soon as the weather warms up. During the winter I do a work out at home, alot of sit ups, and work with weights. As a client leant me the 'Eat and Stay Slim' book, I don't have it for a reference. Thanks for replying and we'll see what happens.

Yes I am a Kiwi, been in Canada many. many years now. I lived in London, England ( we have a London, Ontario, where I also lived) before coming to Canada. Was back in NZ in 1999, my husband's first trip, he just lo ved there, especially as it was the middle of winter and he could play golf!!

Hi O2BSlim,

In answering your question about the strawberries and yoghurt. I use the frozen ones and put them in the food processor chop them up and add a little yoghurt and some Splenda ( sugar sub.) if the berries aren't sweet enough and a touch of lemon. It tastes like ice cream.

I have been doing alot of comparing diets and I think that Somersizing is about the same as Montignac except a few things are different. One is she insists that you eat nothing with your friut, no nuts, and you cannot mix any protien with carbs. except beans. Also you eat protiens with fat. And you can have pasta if it is whole wheat or articoke just not white or semolina flour also brown rice is allowed. But other wise it seems close to what you are doing. Also no sugar or frutose.

The web site you just sent doesn't seem to have much good to say about Montignac. but it does tell alot about the diet, thanks for sending it.

Keep in touch hope you do well!
Jan9

Great to find a board for this. I started Montignac in October, but skipped the first stage entirely. I felt like I needed to start thinking about what I was eating and I knew my cravings always lead me to baked potatos and bread. I have always suffered from extreme mood swings and I've noticed a big difference in this area.

I didn't entend to lose weight, but 5 pounds later, I'm happy and healthy. And the best part is that it is so easy I don't think about it. My husband jokes that it is my "lifestyle" and it is. I've never thought of it as a diet and plan to continue following it forever.

I can't answer any questions about Phase 1, but if you guys want to know about more longterm continuing the method, I could answer some questions.

Smultron

02BSlim and skiwi_nz Ive been reading this thread with great interest and all I wanted to add is a high from New Zealand
I grew up in Devonport on the north shore. I now live on a farm on the kaipara harbour.

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I've just lost my tenth pound (quarter of the way there now!). I feel great and am not tempted to go off the rails.

A big hello to everyone, especially the fellow NZ'ers who are struggling with their weight, wherever they may be now. I was in NZ in February and the pakeha population there mainly seemed a very slim, fit lot. I know that polynesians are prone to carrying more weight; possibly it is genetic or perhaps partly lifestyle.

I am lucky because it is Spring in the UK and I live in an area where there are lots of wonderful places to walk -- along the Thames, Richmond Park, Kew Gardens, etc, so there is really no excuse for me if the kilos do not drop off over the next few months.

Good luck from one of the shrinking Kiwis.

So glad to find fellow followers of Montignac. I've been following the diet for a few weeks now, but have several questions. And I do have the first of the Montignac books, Dine Out and Lost Weight. But there seem to be a number of contradictions as well as ambiguous areas. And I've read the book cover to cover - more than once.

I would love answers to the following:

1. First, in Dine Out and Lost Weight, fructose is on the "no-no" list. But I've read on this site that it is in fact allowed. If it is allowed, in what amount and are there rules as to what it should and should not be mixed with?

2. Dried fruit. Do the same rules apply as with regular fruit? Again, in Dine Out, dried fruit appears on the banned list on one page, and a bit further in the book, is listed on the good carbs list. Very confusing!

3. How much fat (olive oil) is OK? I used about four tablespoons of olive oil to stir fry some veggies in the wok (then added shrimp - very good!). I am accustomed to using no fat at all and am very nervous about using any kind. So, my question: are there any fast guidelines?

4. Is it allowed to mix legumes with fat (not lard, but chicken, cheese, etc.)?

Thanks in advance! I do have a lot more questions, but they'll follow soon!

In his book" Eat yourself slim...and stay slim!" the diet is in two phases. Phase I is for the first three months, and phase II is lifetime maintenance.

As far as I can see some dried fruit is allowed in both phases. These are dried apricots (GI 35), prunes but not raisins. I'm not sure about other dried fruits, but I would know banana chips would be out.

Fructose is allowed as it has a GI of 20, but don't eat too much.

Olive oil is also allowed but be careful of having too much. 4 tablespoons sounds quite a lot for one person at one meal.

I agree that his books are confusing, and I am sure the diet would be alot more popular if he did not contradict himself and gave a comprehensive and clear GI guide. Basically try and keep the GI of everything to under 50. On phase II you can have some higher GI foods, but try and eat very low GI foods first to balance them out. According to Montignac you need to eat low GI foods first to keep the blood sugar level stable.

There are some really good glycaemic/glycemic indices out on the web so if I was you I would use one of those as Montignac's is not much help.

Good luck
Juliette

Hi Juliette,

Thank you for the answers and tips. It was all very helpful. It would be fantastic if we could share menu ideas as they do on other areas of this forum. I have a hunch now that I may be eating too much cheese, based on comments I've read here. I had a completely different impression from the book. Anyway, giving up the potatoes, white rice, pasta, etc., isn't so difficult. But avoiding trace sugars and refined flour, starch, etc. in foods certainly isn't easy. Especially when eating out.

Another unrelated comment: I read in your journal a Montignac book review someone had posted. It seemed so little food was mentioned! I don't think I eat too terribly much, but I must admit that it is near impossible for me to eat three meals a day without even a tiny snack in between.

One last note: I didn't realise all artificial sweeteners were frowned upon by M. I thought there were exceptions. Am I completely wrong?

Thanks again,

Awal

You are right, he doesn't allow artificial sweeteners because apparently most still raise the GI. He is also anti anything artificial or heavily processed. I have to admit to having some diet jelly (jello) which is artificially sweetened, because I love jelly and it contains only about 8 cals per serving and it doesn't contain much artificial sweetener per portion.

I used to eat popcorn, home popped and unbuttered or sweetened, but of course that is an absolute no-no on Montignac.

I'm eating really well. I have porridge (jumbo oatmeal) in the morning made with skim milk. I make it in a saucepan on the top of the stove and takes about 5 minutes. I soak some finely chopped dried fruit (apricots, peaches, prunes, apple) in hot water and then put into the fridge and use a tablespoon of that each day to sweeten and flavour the porridge. The good thing about it is that I am not hungry until lunchtime.

If I do get hungry between meals I eat an apple or an orange or something like that, but as I am drinking more water I don't get as hungry. I also drink tea during the day, which I have also drunk without milk or sugar. I ocasionally have coffee, (espresso) but I try to have no instant coffee as he doesn't allow it unless it is decaffinated.

I am having friends around for dinner tonight. We will have olives and raw almonds for nibbles. A small rocket salad with some smoked salmon as a starter, roast lamb done studded with rosemary and garlic, (potato slices cooked underneath the lamb on the roasting rack for those not on Montignac), cherry tomatoes oven roasted with rosemary, a little rock salt, pepper and drizzle of olive oil, and fresh green beans. I will also be drinking wine and probably have a coffee afterwards.

No pudding, but will have cheeses which I will eat with a knife and fork and leave the cheese biscuits and bread to others. Normally we only have one course at home, but we do cook rather than rely on ready-made or convenience foods. We eat a lot of fish which is highly recommended on Montignac.

I will send you some basic meal ideas over the next few days as I am in a bit of a rush today.

I am definitely losing some weight with Montignac and can also see the difference which is fantastic. It is not a quick fix plan, but more about educated eating choices.

Hi,

Thanks for the additional info. It sounds as if you think very similarly to the way I think. Starting Montignac hasn't been difficult for me either. I have long believed in the benefits of eating unprocessed foods. Where the question of the artificial sweetener came in was in regard to fresh strawberry jam, which I love! (OK. So there were a few other items as well, sugar free ice-cream and yoghurt, which I can't get here in Oslo, but are available in the states, etc.)

Another question that comes to mind is in regard to beans. Do you eat them with fats? I love homemade hummus, but was curious whether it is allowed with grilled chicken.

I do love fish as well - one of my favourites at the moment is Escolar, which I grill in my heavy "grill pan".

Oh! Another questionable item: coconut milk. I was in the habit before of making Thai soup with low-fat coconut milk. But I couldn't find the GI and felt it could in fact be a "poor choice" item. Do you know?

I don't think coconut is a good choice because it is very high in fat, however I also love Thai food and sometimes make Tom Yum and Tom Ka Kai. I use a little bit of the pastes available from my local Thai supermarket, but because I use so much water and add lots of vegetables, e.g. chopped green beans, peas, celery, a bit of onion, capsicum, a chilli and fresh coriander (by the way sweetcorn is not allowed), shrimp and some al dente egg noodles I think it probably balances it out. Adding those vegetables makes it less authentic but it fills me up and I would eat each of these soups at least once a week for dinner.

By the way cooked carrots are not allowed, but raw carrots are okay. Cook your noodles al dente and add them again just as you serve the soup. Noodles like spaghetti, etc have a higher GI the longer you cook them. Montignac advocates unrefined organic flour pasta products, but they are still not a very low GI food. I put a much smaller amount of noodles in the soup than I would have in the past, but it is just as good and I don't miss the extra noodles.

About icecream, he says you can eat low fat alginate(spelling?) icecream occasionally in phase II, but I haven't seen that in our supermarkets. I think it probably better to steer away from icecream completely during Phase I and indulge yourself occasionally with the real thing in Phase II after your have eaten some very low GI food first.

Here's a recipe from Montignac's book as I can't find anything about Houmus in the index.

Chick Pea Puree - serves 4

400g chick peas
soya cream (no quanitity given)
1 onion
1 tbsp chopped fresh coriander
3 tbsp olive oil
salt and pepper

Soak the chick peas overnight. peel and chop the onion. Put hte onion and drained chick peas in salty water and cook for 2 hours.

Drain and transfer to a blender. Blend, adding olive oil and cream of soya graudally. Sprinkle in chopped coriander. Grind in some salt and black pepper to taste. Serve hot. This makes agood accompaniment to a spicy dish.

I'll put another recipe on a separate posting.
Juliette

This is what he says before the recipe part of the book. There are only about 20 recipes in the book, you are encouraged to use them as a guideline to create your own.

Eliminate all carbohydrates with a high glycaemic index, partiuclarly sugar (sugar or saccharose), white flour, potatoes, cooked carrots, modern maize or sweetcorn, white rice (except Basmati), noodles, macaroni, ravioli, etc. He contradicts the bit about noodles, macaroni in another part of the book, saying choose ones that are organic, use unrefined flour and cook until just tender for a lower GI

Try to include carbohydrates that have good nutritional qualities and will help weight loss, uch as lentils, dried beans, chick peas, peas, green vegetables (lettuce, broccoli, cabbage, french beans, spinach aubergine, capsicums, tomatoes, courgettes), unrefined cereals, fruit.

Use good fats - olive oil, goose fat, duck fat, sunflower oil, walnut oil, rapeseed oil.

Eliminate bad fats - cooked butter (including clarified butter), palm oil, lard, margarine.

If possible, choose to eat fish rather than meat (chicken meat without its skin, however is fine).

Avoid cooking at high temperatures, particularly deep fat frying.

I did a Google search by typing in coconut milk glycemic index and came up with this:

Diabetes Update

Coconuts "Recently, several people have asked me about the glycemic index of coconut. I had no idea what the GI of coconut was until I looked into it.

Remember, the GI measures how fast the available carbohydrates in the food raise blood sugar. By available carbohydrates I mean (as explained on my GI page) the total carbohydrates minus the fiber. That's because while we count fiber as carbohydrates (in this country), they have no effect on blood sugar.

So, look at the composition of coconut and coconut milk at http://www.nal.usda.gov/fnic/cgi-bin/nut_search.pl :

It finds 32 types. For example, 100 grams of Nuts, coconut meat, raw is mostly fat—33 grams. It has a bit of protein, 3 grams, and only 6 grams of available carbohydrate (carbohydrate minus fiber).

Similarly, with 100 grams of Nuts, coconut milk, raw (liquid expressed from grated meat and water). It has 24 grams of fat, 2 grams of protein, and 3 grams of carbohydrate.

These numbers would put coconut and coconut milk within the range of those products that are not feasible to test—since they have to test 50 grams of available carbohydrate. That would mean, for example, that the test subjects would have to drink 3333 grams of the stuff, which is too much to ask of anyone!

All the fat in the coconut will also slow down any blood sugar rise that the carbohydrates might provide. Therefore, I would have to conclude that the GI of coconut and coconut milk has to be quite low."

Karen

Fructose is allowed, and apparently there is a sweetener called stevia is okay. The book says the best one comes from Paraguay.
Meals should be either:

A carbohydrate/protein mix with no saturated fats and little poly or mono unsaturated fats. Carbohydrates must have a glycaemic index below 50.
Or, a protein/lipid mix (lipids are fats). This means meat together with fat, but minimal fat. Carbohydrates with a very low glycaemic rate such as green lentils, chick peas mushrooms, tomatoes, aubergines (egg plant), capsicums (peppers), salad and green vegetables are allowed with this mix.

Here's another recipe from his book:

Spaghetti with sweet and sour aubergine and tomato sauce - serves 4

400gm spaghetti (try to get organic, unrefined, wholemeal)
2 aubergines
200gm tomatoes
1 onion
4 tbsp olive oil
1 bouquet garni
2 tbsp chopped basil
3 tbsp balsamic vinegar
salt, pepper and cayenne

Cover the tomatoes iwth boiling water for 30 seconds. Drain peel, remove seeds and dice. I'd probably use a tin of tomatoes for speed. Wash and dice the aubergines. He doesn't say anything about salting, standing and then rinsing the aubergines to get rid of the bitterness, but I would advocate this..

In a pan, sweat the onion in a little olive oil. Add the tomatoes. Cook for 15 minutes with bouquet garni, chopped basil, salt, pepper and cayenne. Add the balsamic vinegar at the end of the cooking.

In another pan, saute the aubergine in olive oil. Seaon. Allow to cook for 6 or 7 minutes then stir into the tomato sauce.

Cook the paste until al dente and drain.

Remove the bouquet garnie from the sauce. Add the sauce to the spaghetti, mix and season to taste.

Enjoy!

You can have your strawberry jam, providing you choose or make the right kind.

Here's what he says about jam:

"You should not have traditional jam as it contains about 65% sugar. Instead I would suggest a sugar-free jam; one that contains neither sugar nor juices like grape juice, which contain the sugar dextrose.

Sugar-free jam can be made with fructose, or the juice of apples and pears, which is even better. Finally, the more fruit pulp reduced to aj elly there happens to be in a pot, the better. These jams have a low glycaemic index, are delcious and make an ideal accompaniment to good bread."

Also, here's the GI details of "good icecream"

Icecream made with alginates - carbohydrate concentration 25g, Glycaemic Index 35. Good luck with finding it!

Juliette