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  #16   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 01:02
JandLsMom's Avatar
JandLsMom JandLsMom is offline
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Posts: 1,719
 
Plan: atkins induction
Stats: 330/330/165 Female 5' 10"
BF:
Progress: 0%
Location: Illinois
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Jen,
Thanks for posting this. I am way over my fear of fat..lol. Actually i never really feared it too much. i only did a low fat diet once and almost ended up with anorexia because of it. I was ALWAYS hungry on that diet too! . My problem for many years was i ate all the fat AND all the carbs...lol. Now i am perfectly satisfied with JUST the FAT!! Its so bizarre that we were all soooo duped! It's sad that many people are STILL duped!!
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  #17   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 03:38
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Ayustar Ayustar is offline
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Posts: 2,967
 
Plan: Human Experimentation
Stats: 170/100/105 Female 4'10
BF:
Progress: 108%
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
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Deep fried bacon rules. Trust me, hahaha.

I hate the fact that fat is soooo demonized, we have totally been lied to. It is rediculous. They were always pushing grains, always saying meat or proteins were bad and fats are evil. No one really mentioned sugars, they really said to avoid candy as your main staple. That should just be a "DUH" wherever you come from. God....fat of course is also bad in conjunction with high carb, that is bad, and I think that is the only time fat is bad when it goes hand in hand with carbs. It just makes it much worse.

Then what pisses me off more is that I get judged on my choices with what I eat and what I don't. Well, I don't know, I think I want to be healthy and not fat. I will eat fat to lose fat. I know people can't wrap their minds around that one because of the lies they have been fed, well, those lies are just keeping them fat or making them fatter. People can't embrace change, and it's not even a fact that HAS changed...people just didn't realize it or didn't want to realize it and you KNOW there is $$$ involved here. It just makes me really angry. Oh well, I will keep eating mayo and coconut oil, damn them and I will be just fine, we all will, we know better.
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  #18   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 07:36
Jen B
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Quote:
fat of course is also bad in conjunction with high carb
Or stated a little differently, fat is never bad; it's always the high carb.

Ayustar, I hear where you're coming from on being pissed off about people judging our choices and the fact that we've been duped. That is my initial reaction too. But then, as the injustice of it all sinks in and I make my own choices and I move away from the main stream, I realize that all those people served an important purpose for me. They helped me to wake up and shake off the hypnosis, the brainwashing, and to take charge of my own fate. Those people are the ones that serve as an impetus for me to make positive, empowering change. Once I get to that point, I can thank them.

I love the message in your signature, by the way. It acknowledges that we consist of both dark and light, and that the two are actually one. Without judgment of the dark, it can be incorporated into the light. That's kind of what I was talking about above. If we judge the naysayers and liars as negative, then we create a rift that doesn't need to exist. But if we acknowledge them for their purpose in the "whole," then we are free. Does that make sense?

Anyway, speaking of fats, I think it's crucial to distinguish the trans fats out from the rest of them. Anything hydrogenated is trans fat. That includes most bottled salad dressings and mayos. Hydrogenated oil is found in an insane amount of packaged foods. That's why I just make my own stuff and rarely buy anything out of a bottle or package.

What I do is buy expeller or cold pressed oils and make my own mayo and salad dressing. It's SO easy with a blender or food processor to make the creamiest mayo and dressings ever. I use either virgin olive oil or walnut oil for mayo and dressings. Nut oils are really tasty! If anyone wants to know how to make a killer mayo in just a few minutes, let me know. It doesn't taste quite like commercial mayo, of course, but you acquire a taste for it rapidly, IMO.

I avoid canola oil and soy oil (or anything soy for that matter) like the plague, hydrogenated or not. I avoid vegetable oils in general (because there are so many conflicting opinions about their healthfulness), except olive oil (which I don't think is a vegetable anyway).

I use bacon fat (from uncured bacon from the HFS), organic ghee (clarified butter), and Tropical Traditions coconut oil for cooking or sauteing. And then, of course, I eat my whopping serving of virgin coconut oil (or coconut cream-heaven!) daily for all the good health benefits it provides, including help with my weight loss.

That brings us down to eggs, fatty fish, chicken skin/fat, and fat on meat. I definitely always buy organic (no hormones/antibiotics), and I get as much grass-fed meat/chicken as I can. I have a box freezer and order it online. I get organic Omega 3 eggs from the health food store.

On fish, I eat salmon (usually smoked in our smoker-OMG-to die for!) and tuna packaged in water. I know they say that most fish is contaminated these days. That's kind of where I close my eyes and hope that anything tainted about fish will be overshadowed by all the good food choices I make. I love fish!!! And certainly don't want to do without it.

The Omega 3/6 balance thing is something else to consider, I think. From all the years of eating grain and grain-fed animals, we have been existing on very little Omega 3 and an over-abundance of Omega 6, with disastrous health consequences. Eliminating grain from the diet helps a lot. I read that a normal grocery store egg contains Omega 6/3 in a ratio of 19/1, whereas an organic Omega 3 egg from a free range chicken is 1/1. That's quite a difference!

One way to help with the balance is taking flax oil (which is expensive) or 2 T of flaxseeds (ground as you use them) per day (which is fairly cheap). Another way is fish oil (I use Carlson's), which is still expensive but it goes a long way. Because I eat flaxseeds every day and I eat Omega 3 eggs and something grass-fed nearly every day, I don't always supplement with the fish oil.

If anyone sees any flaws in my logic in any of this, I would welcome your comments.

Have a great fat-eating, non-hungry day!
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  #19   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 08:34
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sunrise02 sunrise02 is offline
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Posts: 240
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 170/170/130 Female 63 in
BF:
Progress: 0%
Location: TN--but miss my SC mtns!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jen B
Or stated a little differently, fat is never bad; it's always the high carb.

Ayustar, I hear where you're coming from on being pissed off about people judging our choices and the fact that we've been duped. That is my initial reaction too. But then, as the injustice of it all sinks in and I make my own choices and I move away from the main stream, I realize that all those people served an important purpose for me. They helped me to wake up and shake off the hypnosis, the brainwashing, and to take charge of my own fate. Those people are the ones that serve as an impetus for me to make positive, empowering change. Once I get to that point, I can thank them.

I love the message in your signature, by the way. It acknowledges that we consist of both dark and light, and that the two are actually one. Without judgment of the dark, it can be incorporated into the light. That's kind of what I was talking about above. If we judge the naysayers and liars as negative, then we create a rift that doesn't need to exist. But if we acknowledge them for their purpose in the "whole," then we are free. Does that make sense?

Anyway, speaking of fats, I think it's crucial to distinguish the trans fats out from the rest of them. Anything hydrogenated is trans fat. That includes most bottled salad dressings and mayos. Hydrogenated oil is found in an insane amount of packaged foods. That's why I just make my own stuff and rarely buy anything out of a bottle or package.

What I do is buy expeller or cold pressed oils and make my own mayo and salad dressing. It's SO easy with a blender or food processor to make the creamiest mayo and dressings ever. I use either virgin olive oil or walnut oil for mayo and dressings. Nut oils are really tasty! If anyone wants to know how to make a killer mayo in just a few minutes, let me know. It doesn't taste quite like commercial mayo, of course, but you acquire a taste for it rapidly, IMO.

I avoid canola oil and soy oil (or anything soy for that matter) like the plague, hydrogenated or not. I avoid vegetable oils in general (because there are so many conflicting opinions about their healthfulness), except olive oil (which I don't think is a vegetable anyway).

I use bacon fat (from uncured bacon from the HFS), organic ghee (clarified butter), and Tropical Traditions coconut oil for cooking or sauteing. And then, of course, I eat my whopping serving of virgin coconut oil (or coconut cream-heaven!) daily for all the good health benefits it provides, including help with my weight loss.

That brings us down to eggs, fatty fish, chicken skin/fat, and fat on meat. I definitely always buy organic (no hormones/antibiotics), and I get as much grass-fed meat/chicken as I can. I have a box freezer and order it online. I get organic Omega 3 eggs from the health food store.

On fish, I eat salmon (usually smoked in our smoker-OMG-to die for!) and tuna packaged in water. I know they say that most fish is contaminated these days. That's kind of where I close my eyes and hope that anything tainted about fish will be overshadowed by all the good food choices I make. I love fish!!! And certainly don't want to do without it.

The Omega 3/6 balance thing is something else to consider, I think. From all the years of eating grain and grain-fed animals, we have been existing on very little Omega 3 and an over-abundance of Omega 6, with disastrous health consequences. Eliminating grain from the diet helps a lot. I read that a normal grocery store egg contains Omega 6/3 in a ratio of 19/1, whereas an organic Omega 3 egg from a free range chicken is 1/1. That's quite a difference!

One way to help with the balance is taking flax oil (which is expensive) or 2 T of flaxseeds (ground as you use them) per day (which is fairly cheap). Another way is fish oil (I use Carlson's), which is still expensive but it goes a long way. Because I eat flaxseeds every day and I eat Omega 3 eggs and something grass-fed nearly every day, I don't always supplement with the fish oil.

If anyone sees any flaws in my logic in any of this, I would welcome your comments.

Have a great fat-eating, non-hungry day!



Thanks for the info, Jen. Good guidelines and impressive.

I would like to work toward being that consistent. Right now, I cannot afford the organic diet even though I think it may be best. The other problem is--I wonder if all that stuff REALLY is organic or if they just tell us it is. You know, when you've been DUPED, you begin to be wary of everything!

So, if we are eating sooo many "unbalanced" grocery store eggs--are we in danger of Omega 6 overload?

If you were to prepare something like "hot wings" (or deep fried bacon, lol) what oil would you use?

Thanks, Jen!
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  #20   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 11:29
AuntJoyce's Avatar
AuntJoyce AuntJoyce is offline
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Posts: 202
 
Plan: Protein Power /Bernstein
Stats: 250/225/150 Female 67
BF:
Progress: 25%
Location: Washington State
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Speaking of hot wings -- I made some extra good oven fried chicken thighs last weekend and I thought this technique could be used for wings. I had saved my bacon fat. And by the way, I baked 2 packages of bacon in a large baking sheet and then I freeze the cooked bacon. That way I can grab one or two slices at a time.

Preheat oven to 425 F. I usually bake my chicken in my broiler pan. This time, I smeared it liberally with the bacon grease. I rubbed a nice cajun spice on the chicken. Place chicken on the broiler pan skin side DOWN first. Bake for about 30 minutes and then turn for another 30-45 minutes. The bacon grease helps make the skin nice and crispy.

But being a northerner, I just can't get used to that vinegary sauce ya'll use down there in the south!

Jen: How long does your homemade mayo keep in the fridge? Or do you just make one serving at a time? I've gone mostly organic too. Grass fed beef has so much more CLA which can help in weight loss and other things. I have located local farms on the internet and would like to visit them and buy their beef one of these days.
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  #21   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 13:16
Jen B
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Quote:
From Sunrise02: Right now, I cannot afford the organic diet even though I think it may be best. The other problem is--I wonder if all that stuff REALLY is organic or if they just tell us it is. You know, when you've been DUPED, you begin to be wary of everything!
Sunrise, I know what you mean. For me, it's just me and my husband. Were both purists. We stop at the produce isle and the meat counter at our local HFS and that's basically it. Our grocery list usually has under 10 items on it! I guess it's just a matter of trust that the stuff is what they say it is. One will never know for sure!!

If I were going to deep fry something, I would use Tropical Traditions expeller pressed coconut oil (it doesn't have the coconut flavor) because it withstands a great amount of heat. I think the nut oils would work too.

Quote:
From AuntJoyce: But being a northerner, I just can't get used to that vinegary sauce ya'll use down there in the south!
Ha! You must be talking about my Arizona Gunslinger Habenero Sauce! I love that stuff!

Quote:
From AuntJoyce: How long does your homemade mayo keep in the fridge? Or do you just make one serving at a time?
I make 1 cup at a time and it's supposed to be ok for a week. Don't think I'd go longer than that. It has a raw egg in it.

Last edited by Jen B : Thu, Mar-16-06 at 13:32.
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  #22   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 13:52
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Hellistile Hellistile is offline
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Posts: 2,540
 
Plan: Animal-based/IF
Stats: 252/215.6/130 Female 5'4
BF:
Progress: 30%
Location: Vancouver Island
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Once I discovered low carb, it was very difficult for me to get over my fat phobia. Took me about 1 year. However, last night I made chicken breasts fried in lard, with a sauce I made with onions and mushrooms (fried in coconut oil and lard), sour cream, dill and heavy cream. I am now looking for ways to add fat to the meat, lol. Keeping hard copies of bloodwork results reinforces that this way of eating is great for the body.
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  #23   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 14:38
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gryfonclaw gryfonclaw is offline
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Posts: 360
 
Plan: Not sure yet
Stats: 253/218/155 Female 69 inches
BF:D:
Progress: 36%
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I usually buy organic eggs whenever I can (cause I can do $4 a pop versus $20+ for organic meats).

I do have a question...where can one find lard? Whenever I ask a clerk at the grocery store they just kinda look at me funny....

Jen B, I shop Tropical Traditions for my CO too...I've recently switched from the Virgin CO to the Expeller pressed cause it's cheaper...think that'll work just as well?

I also have difficulty consuming enough coconut oil in a day...do you have any suggestions? Plus, how do you make your mayo? I'm trying to avoid soy also.

Thanks for your help!
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  #24   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 15:00
mama22boys mama22boys is offline
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Posts: 101
 
Plan: general low carb
Stats: 176/148/130 Female 64 inches
BF:
Progress: 61%
Location: minnesota
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I think that part of the reason the saturated fat and cholesterol have gotten such a bad reputation with regard to heart healthy diets is because that was/is what was/is found in the arteries when doctors takes a look at those with heart disease. The reason...sat.fat and cholesterol are in there repairing the damage done by things like trans fat (which become rancid and toxic), free radicals, and the damage done when insulin spikes and plummets in the blood (due to simple carb/high carb/processed carb crap). Those things cause small lesions to form in the arteries and sat. fat and cholesterol go in to heal that. So the sat.fat and cholesterol that were found 'clogging' the arteries were actually masking the real problem and were instead used as a easy answer/scapegoat. High sat. fat and cholesterol in the arteries should tip the doctors off that there is something else going seriously wrong in the body that is making all the sat. fat and cholesterol flood into the blood system to do some serious work.

The info was from the book "Politically Incorrect Nutrition." I can't remember the author but it was an interesting read. This may not be exactly what the book said, but that was the gist. If you are interested in getting the info straight from the horse's mouth than pick up the book.
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  #25   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 16:27
Jen B
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gryfonclaw: Here's how I eat my daily coconut oil: I melt about 3 T. of coconut oil, grind up 2 T. of flax seeds, add in 1 t. cinnamon, and a shake of stevia. If I'm feeling really decadent, I'll add 1-2 T almond butter or 1 oz of broken up pecans, as well as 1 T unsweetened cocoa. I pour the mixture onto some cling wrap that I've placed in a small tupperware lid, then put it in the frig or freezer to harden. I eat it like a cookie with my coffee for breakfast. Delicious! And it sticks with me for hours.

I like the flavored coconut oil for eating, but cook with the expeller pressed. I don't know about lard. I think you could get it from a butcher or farmer. I got some bison fat from the company I order grass-fed bison from online. One of these days, I'll render it and use it as lard.

Mayo:
1 egg
1 T lemon juice (could use vinegar or 1/2 each)
1/4 t dry mustard
1/4 t salt
pepper (I use cayenne)
1 c. walnut oil (or half olive)

Put first 5 ingreds in blender or food processor. Blend for 1/2 minute, then pour in oil in a thin steady stream through the food tube or hole in blender lid while machine is still running. By the time you pour in all the oil, it should be thick and creamy. If you're gonna use this for coleslaw dressing, add some stevia or other sweetner.

Mama22boys: That's very interesting about the artery clog thing. I never knew that. It explains a lot, I think. Thanks.

Hellistile: Sounds like you might be a good candidate for the deep-fried bacon.

Last edited by Jen B : Thu, Mar-16-06 at 18:48.
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  #26   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 17:41
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sunrise02 sunrise02 is offline
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Posts: 240
 
Plan: atkins
Stats: 170/170/130 Female 63 in
BF:
Progress: 0%
Location: TN--but miss my SC mtns!
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mama22boys
I think that part of the reason the saturated fat and cholesterol have gotten such a bad reputation with regard to heart healthy diets is because that was/is what was/is found in the arteries when doctors takes a look at those with heart disease. The reason...sat.fat and cholesterol are in there repairing the damage done by things like trans fat (which become rancid and toxic), free radicals, and the damage done when insulin spikes and plummets in the blood (due to simple carb/high carb/processed carb crap). Those things cause small lesions to form in the arteries and sat. fat and cholesterol go in to heal that. So the sat.fat and cholesterol that were found 'clogging' the arteries were actually masking the real problem and were instead used as a easy answer/scapegoat. High sat. fat and cholesterol in the arteries should tip the doctors off that there is something else going seriously wrong in the body that is making all the sat. fat and cholesterol flood into the blood system to do some serious work.

The info was from the book "Politically Incorrect Nutrition." I can't remember the author but it was an interesting read. This may not be exactly what the book said, but that was the gist. If you are interested in getting the info straight from the horse's mouth than pick up the book.


Mama22--That was the best explanation I have everheard. Sounds very plausible, too. Thanks!

As I was reading it--I was thinking about cattle--they eat grain and grass all the time and look at the FAT on them! So much for the "low fat-vegetarian concept." But, I guess they need it as protection from the elements.
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  #27   ^
Old Thu, Mar-16-06, 22:41
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Ayustar Ayustar is offline
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Posts: 2,967
 
Plan: Human Experimentation
Stats: 170/100/105 Female 4'10
BF:
Progress: 108%
Location: London, Ontario, Canada
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Jen B, thanks for your comments. I know what you mean. I just figured fat in conjunction with carbs just makes them all the more dangerous. That was always my out look. It may be false but either way I am no demonizing the fat there, just the carbs, just the combination can't be good either way.

Yeah, taking into consideration about the people who can't embrace change, I understand what you mean. It may be hard for us taking all the flack but in the end I believe we are right. There is just too much research out there that proves this is the better way to do things...it should be out there, it should be accepted. I mean honestly, if people who have diabetes or other things do low carb or high fat with minimal carbs and they are able to control their illnesses without the use of medications, and their blood tests look fantastic AND they lose weight....where is the problem!? People just can't get it out of there minds and I think it is going to take society a long time to accept this.
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  #28   ^
Old Fri, Mar-17-06, 06:49
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RedJodie RedJodie is offline
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Posts: 949
 
Plan: M&E
Stats: 159/118.5/120 Female 5'4"
BF:Clueless
Progress: 104%
Location: Moncton, NB
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jen B
You must be talking about my Arizona Gunslinger Habenero Sauce! I love that stuff!


Ok, is this a store bought sauce or something I can make at home? I love hot stuff.....
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  #29   ^
Old Fri, Mar-17-06, 07:57
Jen B
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Good morning, all fat-lovers everywhere!

RedJodie: Arizona Gunslinger is a company out of Mesa, AZ. They have a number of delicious hot products. I can get a couple of their sauces at the grocery stores here in Arizona, but there's much more available. Look at www.azgunslinger.com Their 'smokin hot jalepeno sauce' says "All natural ingredients: jalepeno peppers, vinegar, and salt."

I have been ordering grass-fed beef from this company: http://www.grasslandbeef.com/index.html I really like dealing with them. The shipping cost is included in with the price of the product, so there are no surprises. And I order one day and it is delivered the next day by DHL. I have talked with the owner several times on the phone, and he is so friendly and knowledgeable. I just ordered eye of round roasts and I make jerky out of them. Delicious!! (I made up a heavenly jerky marinade that is free of Worcesteshire and soy sauce, if anyone's interested.) I also buy their sugar-free hot dogs and ground beef. They even have pemmican in tubs and bars (meat mixed with fat).

At our HFS, they have organic lamb for a pretty reasonable price. I also have a good rosemary-lemon marinade for that. I asked the butcher there: "Is this grass-fed lamb?" He kind of smiled at me with a very tolerant look and said: "All lamb is grass-fed. They won't eat anything else!" I sure hope he's right. Does anyone know? Anyway, I'm trusting him for now and am really enjoying it.

Quote:
From Sunrise02: So, if we are eating sooo many "unbalanced" grocery store eggs--are we in danger of Omega 6 overload?
I would venture to say that anyone who hasn't done the research and adjusted their Omega EFA balance is suffering from Omega 6 overload.
Quote:
It is estimated that 85% or more of people in the Western world are deficient in omega-3 fatty acids and most get far too much of the omega-6 fatty acids. Vegetarian diets, for example, tend to be very high in omega-6. http://www.mercola.com/beef/omega3_oil.htm
The above link is a pretty good article, even though I disagree with the statement in the first paragraph: "saturated fats from animal products should be kept to a minimum."

BTW, I forgot to mention that part of my daily routine is to take some Evening Primrose Oil, which I think is an important piece of the "fat balance" puzzle.

Ack, I'm running late for work. Gotta go! Have an excellent day!
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  #30   ^
Old Fri, Mar-17-06, 08:18
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lynnp lynnp is offline
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Posts: 4,072
 
Plan: My Version of M/E
Stats: 284/000/140 Female 65 inches
BF:54%/49.5%/25%
Progress: 197%
Location: Rhode Island
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Wow, chatty, chatty people!!!

I love salmon raw with vinegar, soy and wasabi...yummy.

Jennifer, I'd love more VCO recipes you want to share...I just bought my first bottle.

Just a thought...people on low fat end up looking old and brittle for a reason...our cells, every one in the body is made up of a membrane called a protein lipid bilayer. What that means is that the outer membrane of every cell in your body is made up of protein and fat. If you eat low fat, your cells are weaker and they cannot function at an optimal level. There are also 4 vitamins (A,D, E, and K) which are fat soluble (only dissolve in fat) so you can become deficient on low fat. These are important vitamins too. So remember: along with your fat, you need to get enough protein to maintain your lean mass (take your weight and divide in half. That is the number of grams of protein you need each day at a minimum).
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