Hey guys, quit ripping me off. I have serious problems which are not psychosematic. Indeed, however, a lot of it has been caused by starvation but I would starve myself (bad idea) because food always gives me such a hard time. In the end, it just made the problem worse though.

I agree that high carb is bad, I just think that I was eating too low carb. So would 100g carb, made up of fibrous sources like broccoli and maybe some lentils and nuts be ok? I was planning on upping my carb quantity slowly till it made up about 30% of my caloric intake. What macronutrient ratios do you guys use?

I do get hypoglycemia from eating protein. But I'm starting to suspect it's because either: 1) I eat too much broccoli with the protein and it has a hard time digesting so it's like eating nothing or 2) it's the glucophage messing with my livers ability to respond to glucagon.
I don't follow a high protein diet or a high carb diet. I'm still pretty low cal for the most part, but not in ketosis anymore so that's something.
Do you think something like 30/40/30 (protein, carbs, fat) macronutrient would work? I've heard of many people reversing insulin resistance like this.

What worries me about, e.g. Atkins, is that you eat so much protein which does itself cause a large insulin secretion (but a large secretion of glucagon too). Maybe not as much as glucose, but a cheese omellette will definitely spike your insulin! So for somebody with insulin resistance, a moderate protein, rich in green things, moderate carb, moderate fat diet composed of small, frequent meals might be superior.

In any event, I do battle with carbs so I doubt I will ever be on a high carb diet again, but I do think I need to up my carbs, maybe to like 100 a day or even 150g

Incidentally, I am not 100% sure it is hypoglycemia that attacks me after a protein meal. It doesn't always happen. What happens is I get extremely tired, sometimes with terrible weakness in my limbs and I need to nap. It wears off in about two hours or sometimes three. It could be liver related, but I think it's hypoglycemia. If it happens several times in a row, it causes severe carb cravings.

I'm about 15% carbs, 63% fat, 22% protein. Carbs are mostly from fruit and nuts, little or no veggies.

Well, if you're saying you have problems eating carbs and problems eating protein, try eating more fat, like Hybrid here. Seems clear enough to me.
If you aren't sure what's happening with your blood sugar, maybe you should get a testing rig. They are a little pricey, what with the lances and the testing strips, but you don't need a prescription. Go ask the pharmacist; mine picked up a free circular and ripped out a coupon making my testing kit nearly free, although refills aren't.

Why do you think Glucophage (metformin) is messing with your liver? Did you already have liver problems? If you did, you shoudn't be taking it.

I'm with Hybrid on this - Atkins is not a high-protein diet, it's a high-fat diet. Dr Atkins made this very clear in his books. I get at least 70% of my calories from fat, mainly saturated fat. I keep carbs under 20grams/day, on average. I've been doing this for a year and my blood lipids (and health in general) are much improved since I started this.

Wyv

Yakumo, after reading your long list of ills and problems, I feel compelled to point out here that none of us are doctors or nutritionists and that perhaps your number and degree of problems are beyond what a support forum is equipped to handle and would be better addressed via professionals. We can offer advice and support regarding low carb diets and eating based on our own experiences and what the book from the various plan tells us but anything more than that (ie how to correct medical issues with diet) is really beyond the scope of this forum.
It seems to me that a lot of what you have or think is wrong with you is self-diagnosed (hypoglycemia, for example) and based on symptoms, not actual scientific testing.
My suggestion would be to see a doctor and have actual blood tests done to confirm or rule out any problems you have or think you have and go from there.

I am being treated by a battery of doctors, but none of them have been able to help me eat better. Perhaps I should indeed try just have a high fat diet. But I think that low carb, low protein, high fat is not good for somebody who is so underweight like me. But I will definitely be lowering my protein again. The high protein experiment was a disaster. Makes me feel good temporarily (calories! Yay!) but then such lethargy sets in. Man, I don't want to live on fat...

Hybrid, can you give me an example of a typical day's menu?

I should point out though, that I have tried low protein, low carb, high fat meals. Once I had a bunch of broccoli and some lecithin. What a waste that was. Made my hunger go away (all the lecithin did) - for like one hour, but it really didn't do much for me.

whats lecithin? and how can one meal do much for anyone? Am I missing a point?

Jo

Yakumo, since you claim to be on Atkins you might want to actually read his books. There are lots of sample recipes and menus in them.

Wyv

It can't be any worse than starving yourself and besides low carb and Atkins specifically is not low protein. It's low to moderate carb (based on individual tolerance), adequate protein, moderate to higher fat depending on your carb intake. I'm not clear why you seem to think that you need to stay very low carb, but I'd personally be very surprised if eating more veggies in a larger variety made you feel unwell.
I would think that a male of your size should be getting at least 100-150 grams of quality protein per day. You keep mentioning that you eat a lot of broccoli. There are many, many more vegetables out there that are low carb friendly...try to get a variety of veggies into your menu. If you don't know which veggies you should be considering, refer back to your copy of the Atkins book. Broccoli is certainly a healthy vegetable but a variety of veggies provides you with a variety of nutrients. Add butter to your veggies, Use full fat salad dressings on your salads, eat the fat that naturally comes with the meat (don't trim it off). Don't be afraid of eggs and cheese (unless, of course you happen to be allergic or lactose intolerant). Nuts and avocados are wonderful foods that are healthy for anyone to eat.
Atkins isn't the only low carb plan out there. Several people have already suggested that you take a look at other specific plans; have you taken their suggestion?



Maybe because you're the one who has to actually implement the suggestions and cook the meals? Or are you saying that none of them have given you any useful suggestions on how to improve your diet?



Just a minor correction here. A cheese omelette isn't going to cause an insulin response unless you use half a dozen eggs and a ton of cheese and even then it probably wouldn't in the majority of people. An average omelette of 2-3 eggs, a few ounces of cheese and some veggies shouldn't cause anyone a problem. An egg has about 6 grams of protein and an ouce of cheese has about 6 grams of protein, so 3 eggs and 2 oz of shredded cheese would give you about 30 grams of protein; certainly not a huge amount by any standard.

Well, I tried a high fat, moderate protein, low carb diet for two weeks and my insulin and fasting glucose went back up versus my high fiber diet. I'm convinced that Atkins actually impairs insulin resistance. Let me ask you something: how many of you with insulin problems incl. diabetes type II, if you stop Atkins (or other LC), will be better off than before you started? I bet if you reintroduce carbs, you will start gaining fat, your insulin will spike etc. That means that LC is not capable of reversing insulin resistance. It simply controls it. Whereas a 30/40/30 low sat fat, high fiber, high omega 3 diet WILL reverse it. Sorry. LC makes me feel good, but I just can't believe it'll help me long-term...

Hi Yakumo,

What exactly do you mean by "high fat, moderate protein and low carb?" Because it is virtually impossible for a fasting blood sugar to rise if you are eating really low carb (and low GI carbs) and if you are getting sufficient protein.
So, just how much protein and carbs were you eating?

Thw whole point of following Atkins (or any other low carb plan) is to keep eating this way for life. You gradually reintroduce carbs as you go along, and will not "gain fat" if you follow the principles laid out in DANDR.

Mind you, your reference to gaining fat confuses me a little, given that you are currently underweight. Granted, you should be gaining muscle as well as some fat, but gaining is what you need to do before your health will ever improve.

Rosebud

I wasn't counting calories, but it was low carb and low GI carb. I previously had my fasting insulin and glucose checked while also doing low carb, but high fiber (lots of broccoli) and not so much sat. fat intake. Then I switched to a diet high in saturated fat and meat, very low carb. I think the night before I had my last insulin/glucose check, I did have a big meal - probably too much protein, but still low carb. Anyway, the point is that every time I ate one of these high fat meals, it really increased my appetite rather than decreasing it. It was weird. But I have read several studies since then that say that a high sat fat intake correlated with increased insulin resistance. Anyway, nevermind. Nobody has the definitive answer and the definitive studies haven't been done. Thanks for all your help though.

Also, remember that fasting insulin is not a good test of insulin resistance. Just because your fasting insulin goes down on a low carb diet, doesn't mean your insulin resistance is improving. It means that you are secreting less insulin. The question of insulin resistance can only really be ascertained using a clamp test or perhaps a 3 hour GTT with insulin readings. For example, I can be insulin resistant, and just skip supper, and my morning fasting insulin will be quite low...

So, there is no real evidence that I have ever seen to suggest that LC diets reverse insulin resistance EXCEPT in overweight people who lose fat since fatloss causes increased insulin sensitivity. But this is not an option for me.

Yakumo, I find it rather enlightening that you chose not to answer my question.

I'll give it one more try. What is an example of an average day's food intake during the two week period in which you say you ate "a high fat, moderate protein, low carb diet?"

Rosebud

Hmm, I don't know. It varies every day because my appetite is inconstant. Let me first say that I know high carb will be bad for me. I think though that I need to switch to more monounsat fat, up carbs a little to maybe 50 to 100g a day and keep protein lower.

I would say that on a bad day during my 10 day or so stint on a high sat fat diet, I would have maybe 300g fat, ummm, 100g protein? Or maybe a bit more. Probably more. And very little carbs. Maybe 20g? 30g? Not 100% sure. So that's quite a lot of cals but I was basing it on the Homo Optimus diet. That was on a really bad day when my appetite was crazy (it seems to happen to me if I eat too much sat fat or too many carbs - just feel like eating and eating...). On a typical day, I would have even fewer carbs, and probably less protein, but still upwards of 200g fat. Mostly saturated (almost entirely from MCTs or animal fat).

What do you think is a good macronutrient ratio to pursue? I think if I try to get in around 80g protein (1g per ideal lean kg bodyweight), then I should maybe get 40g protein and about 200g fat? Or 150g fat? I have no real idea. I know that high carb is bad. But it seems high protein and high sat fat is bad for me too....

I think I've just got too many metabolic problems. I always feel like carbs. Even a big steak of a plate of eggs won't satisfy my hunger like a modest bowel of starchy vegetables (like butternut, aubergines, marrows, peppers). I think maybe because my digestion is so impaired? It really sucks. I don't know. I find eating extremely difficult. It is the bane of my life.