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  #271   ^
Old Tue, Jan-02-18, 13:23
Nrracing Nrracing is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 747
 
Plan: Custom 22/2 Clean Fast
Stats: 290/258/210 Male 72.5
BF:
Progress: 40%
Location: Missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEY100
My RSS feeds pick business and weight loss stories...a double header this morning Never heard of this DJ...but millions of others have. We'll see how he does eating unlimited free foods



When WW allowed fruit as a "free food" many members could not lose weight...can't imagine much success with corn and beans too.

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/01/02/wei...-dj-khaled.html


DJ Khaled, is really just hype man for mostly rappers, and he crosses music with other artist. It would be really cool to see him on here and do what we do. He is a go getter, and has money to burn, so he should be able to do it with no problem. He has a chef.
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  #272   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 04:31
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 13,370
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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When a company demures on revealing the $$$ to DJ, it for sure is enough that he will lose weight on WW FreeStyle Plan. Even if he has a chef not making beans and corn and placing 2 blueberries on a piece of fish for decoration, he will claim FreeStyle works. I wish him all success however he wants to lose weight and regain health; saw in a press photo he has the cutest little tike to live for.
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  #273   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 04:53
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 5,283
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
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I had no knowledge of this person previously and certainly on a personal level I wish him well but his hyping a product that is promulgating bad information disturbs me. No doubt he is ignorant of the science. Maybe he believes that this will be a win win for him. Weight Watchers is a for profit company interested in making money but not necessarily interested in promoting health. If everyone figured out how to lose weight and keep it off Weight Watchers would be out of business.

Jean
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  #274   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 09:17
Nrracing Nrracing is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 747
 
Plan: Custom 22/2 Clean Fast
Stats: 290/258/210 Male 72.5
BF:
Progress: 40%
Location: Missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEY100
When a company demures on revealing the $$$ to DJ, it for sure is enough that he will lose weight on WW FreeStyle Plan. Even if he has a chef not making beans and corn and placing 2 blueberries on a piece of fish for decoration, he will claim FreeStyle works. I wish him all success however he wants to lose weight and regain health; saw in a press photo he has the cutest little tike to live for.


Yes Dj does have a little one and needs to slim down to be there later in life. he is a big guy. He is also on the road all the time so him eating out is something that he does often.
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  #275   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 09:20
Nrracing Nrracing is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 747
 
Plan: Custom 22/2 Clean Fast
Stats: 290/258/210 Male 72.5
BF:
Progress: 40%
Location: Missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cotonpal
I had no knowledge of this person previously and certainly on a personal level I wish him well but his hyping a product that is promulgating bad information disturbs me. No doubt he is ignorant of the science. Maybe he believes that this will be a win win for him. Weight Watchers is a for profit company interested in making money but not necessarily interested in promoting health. If everyone figured out how to lose weight and keep it off Weight Watchers would be out of business.

Jean


Jean your correct, I am sure he is a good guy, but DJ is all about making big buck and stacking the money as he would say. He is all about his money and making more. Funny thing is most of the people that are associated with him and his life style are not big or over weight at all. It's Just him
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  #276   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 09:28
teaser's Avatar
teaser teaser is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 15,075
 
Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
BF:
Progress: 104%
Location: Ontario
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I could definitely get leaner eating ad-lib from that list of foods, but first I'd have to get back up to fighting weight by adding back in pizza, muffins etc. I did lose weight back in my low fat days, it worked lots of times, given how many times it worked, the odds of me sticking to that diet permanently, even if it would continue to work for me, seem low. There have been populations where a low fat, high carb diet has resulted in most people being lean, but there compliance isn't much of an issue, of course people will mostly stick to a low fat diet if dietary fat is a relatively rare commodity.
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  #277   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 11:57
Nrracing Nrracing is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 747
 
Plan: Custom 22/2 Clean Fast
Stats: 290/258/210 Male 72.5
BF:
Progress: 40%
Location: Missouri
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Quote:
Originally Posted by teaser
I could definitely get leaner eating ad-lib from that list of foods, but first I'd have to get back up to fighting weight by adding back in pizza, muffins etc. I did lose weight back in my low fat days, it worked lots of times, given how many times it worked, the odds of me sticking to that diet permanently, even if it would continue to work for me, seem low. There have been populations where a low fat, high carb diet has resulted in most people being lean, but there compliance isn't much of an issue, of course people will mostly stick to a low fat diet if dietary fat is a relatively rare commodity.


Teaser, I am with you on this. I just can't see my self going back to eating muffins and pizza. I know it tastes so good, and the sweets, but I just go over board and crush it till I feel like dying.

I mean 6 slices of man meat pizza, soda, then 6 cookies . I am so happy I am rid of that life. I see my guy, and girl friends eating it up and getting bigger each year. I am getting smaller.
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  #278   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 14:41
Calianna's Avatar
Calianna Calianna is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 1,851
 
Plan: Atkins-ish (hypoglycemia)
Stats: 000/000/000 Female 63
BF:
Progress: 50%
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I was discussing the latest and greatest WW version with a friend. She's done WW off and on for years, so she gave me the list of free foods - there are lots of fruits on there, and lots of veggies, most of them low carb (oddly enough, it doesn't include potatoes, even though the USDA would try to convince you that they're classed as veggies). All the protein sources are extremely lean - in addition to soy sources such as tofu and tempeh, it includes skinless chicken breast, turkey breast, fish, seafood, egg substitutes and egg whites.

At any rate, she said that under the new plan, her daily points and anytime points would be reduced even more than they were reduced on last year's plan. So I asked how many points fats were worth - 1 Tbsp butter is worth 5 points, but 1 tsp olive oil is only 1 point (so 3 points/Tbsp for olive oil). Interestingly enough, despite the reduction in her points, she still had enough points that if she chose all her foods exclusively from the free list, then used all her points (daily, and 1/7 of her weekly points) for fats, she could use 7 Tbsp of butter to cook with and/or slather on her food daily for 77 g fat. If she chose to use all those points only for olive oil, she could have even more fats, a total of 12 Tbsp of olive oil, for 168 g fat.

What this amounts to is that on the new WW plan, it would be possible to do it LC, as long as you stuck to only LC choices from the free list, and used all your points for fats.

It's unlikely that anyone would do it that way though, since the main attraction of WW is that no food is off limits, and I'm pretty sure most people would take advantage of the starchy and sugary free foods, then use their points for potatoes, pasta and bread, and occasionally have some other meat, or a dab of fats. Which means of course that it's not likely to work any better for them than the last several incarnations of WW.
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  #279   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 16:34
never2late's Avatar
never2late never2late is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,859
 
Plan: My plan, my way
Stats: 233.8/170.0/179 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 116%
Location: Eastern Tennessee
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You definitely can do WW and low carb together. When I started LC I was on WW. And that is how I did it.
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  #280   ^
Old Wed, Jan-03-18, 16:52
Meme#1's Avatar
Meme#1 Meme#1 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 12,456
 
Plan: Atkins DANDR
Stats: 210/194/160 Female 5'4"
BF:
Progress: 32%
Location: Texas
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What I liked about WW years ago were the meetings with tips and tricks like: 4 ounces of meat is the size of your palm (women's)
Don't eat walking around or standing but sit down at a table and eat slowly so you have time to process what you've eaten.
There were a ton more tips but I can't remember right now.
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  #281   ^
Old Thu, Jan-04-18, 05:14
JEY100's Avatar
JEY100 JEY100 is offline
Posts: 13,370
 
Plan: P:E/DDF
Stats: 225/150/169 Female 5' 9"
BF:45%/28%/25%
Progress: 134%
Location: NC
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CaliAnna...not sure I followed all that the new WW system points system sounds even more OCD with the points that my ancient history with WW! After the CNBC news story, I went to the WW FB page and there were complaints from existing customers that their total number of points were decreased. Your friend called them Daily and anytime points, but members were complaining with fewer points there was less flexibility even with more food "free". Not everyone was thrilled with the new list, but it is interesting that you could make it LC if you carefully managed fat points.
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  #282   ^
Old Thu, Jan-04-18, 05:42
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 5,283
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
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I find the description of the WW plan absurd. Talk about unsustainable. Who wants to do all that calculation based on erroneous assumptions and science? I'll stick with lchf, a lot simpler, a lot more sustainable, a lot easier to understand because based on real science.

Jean
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  #283   ^
Old Thu, Jan-04-18, 05:45
cotonpal's Avatar
cotonpal cotonpal is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 5,283
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
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I imagine that when people join WW it's like joining a club with all those points and counting like the secret handshake. Weight loss isn't some magical formula that gets revised every year. There are basic scientific principles that should guide it and then simple instructions that correspond to those principles, kinda like Westman's original page 4.

Jean
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  #284   ^
Old Thu, Jan-04-18, 08:18
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
Senior Member
Posts: 4,036
 
Plan: Very LC, Higher Protein
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
BF:
Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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Yes, basic nutritional principles that one can apply whether it's a simple Atkins plan or using Westman's guidelines, this is the approach that enabled me to understand and then achieve health through diet. Being consistent in finding and following the correct WOE and dedication to health are all one needs. Simplicity and consistency work.

Special handshakes are for others . . . . . .

Last edited by GRB5111 : Thu, Jan-04-18 at 08:23.
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  #285   ^
Old Thu, Jan-04-18, 09:04
Calianna's Avatar
Calianna Calianna is offline
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Posts: 1,851
 
Plan: Atkins-ish (hypoglycemia)
Stats: 000/000/000 Female 63
BF:
Progress: 50%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JEY100
CaliAnna...not sure I followed all that the new WW system points system sounds even more OCD with the points that my ancient history with WW! After the CNBC news story, I went to the WW FB page and there were complaints from existing customers that their total number of points were decreased. Your friend called them Daily and anytime points, but members were complaining with fewer points there was less flexibility even with more food "free". Not everyone was thrilled with the new list, but it is interesting that you could make it LC if you carefully managed fat points.


My friend wasn't thrilled with her points being lowered either, especially since she likes to indulge in alcohol regularly, and even a single glass of chianti would cost her 5 points.

I think the big problem with WW is that despite all the hype that you can eat anything you want on WW, the points each food costs are not allotted based purely on calorie content. Anything with fat or alcohol content has much higher points than the same number of calories for non-fat foods, and it costs more points to eat anything that's considered to be less healthy. That's why the olive oil points per Tbsp are lower than the butter points per Tbsp. Olive oil may have the exact same number of calories per Tbsp as butter, but the points are still lower, because they consider olive oil to be healthier for you than butter. Even with the difference in points between butter and olive oil, as my friend told me, the point allocation is still punitive for using fats of any kind. And yet, if you chose to eat ten times as many calories worth of food from the free list, it wouldn't cost you a single point.

The points in the last incarnation of WW were also punitive for foods combined into a recipe, since say for instance steamed broccoli and carrots would cost more points than the two separate steamed vegetables, even if you were eating the exact same total amount, and the exact same number of calories. When all fruit was free, you could eat as many individual pieces of fruit as you wanted without using any of your points, but combine those exact same pieces of fruit into a fruit-only smoothie, and it would cost points. Likewise, if you used a recipe from WW, the points would be higher for the ingredients when combined into a recipe, than if you added up the points per serving for the individual ingredients used in their own recipe. I don't know why - I'm assuming they were trying to steer people towards eating simple, plain, individual ingredient foods, rather than any kind taste bud titillating combined foods. My guess is that the points are probably still punitive for eating recipe combinations, and they're trying to enforce this with the extensive list of free foods.

Here's what my friend said about the WW foods (Smart Ones meals and dessert items) that they're still pushing:
Quote:
... now you pay dearly to indulge in them. 2 points for a tiny square of chocolate... Used to be you could eat a gigantic ice cream bar that only cost you one point. When they revamped the plan a couple years ago the same bar was about half the size and 4 points. They call the desserts "snack size" now.


Sadly, calling the desserts "snack size" implies that these are snacks to be indulged in between meals, not a sweet to have at the end of a meal, so WWers who are used to being able to fit dessert into their point allotment are going to expend even more points on what they'd consider to be a fitting dessert, not on some tiny snack size treat.

There's nothing wrong with most of the foods on the free list though:

Quote:
Apples
Applesauce, unsweetened
Apricots
Arrowroot
Artichoke hearts
Artichokes
Arugula
Asparagus


Bamboo shoots
Banana
Beans: including adzuki, black, broad (fava), butter, cannellini, cranberry (Roman), green, garbanzo (chickpeas), great northern, kidney, lima, lupini, mung, navy, pink, pinto, small white, snap, soy, string, wax, white
Beans, refried, fat-free, canned
Beets
Berries, mixed
Blackberries
Blueberries
Broccoli
Broccoli rabe
Broccoli slaw
Broccolini
Brussels sprouts


Cabbage: all varieties including Chinese (bok choy), Japanese, green, red, napa, savory, pickled
Calamari, grilled
Cantaloupe

Carrots
Cauliflower
Caviar
Celery
Swiss chard

Cherries
Chicken breast, ground, 99% fat-free
Chicken breast or tenderloin, skinless, boneless or with bone

Clementines
Coleslaw mix (shredded cabbage and carrots), packaged
Collards

Corn, baby (ears), white, yellow, kernels, on the cob
Cranberries
Cucumber

Daikon
Dates, fresh
Dragon fruit

Edamame, in pods or shelled
Egg substitutes
Egg whites

Eggplant
Eggs, whole, including yolks
Endive
Escarole


Fennel (anise, sweet anise, or finocchio)
Figs
Fish: anchovies, arctic char, bluefish, branzino (sea bass), butterfish, carp, catfish, cod, drum, eel, flounder, grouper, haddock, halibut, herring, mackerel, mahimahi (dolphinfish), monkfish, orange roughy, perch, pike, pollack, pompano, rainbow trout (steelhead), rockfish, roe, sablefish (including smoked), salmon (all varieties), salmon, smoked (lox), sardines, sea bass, smelt, snapper, sole, striped bass, striped mullet, sturgeon (including smoked); white sucker, sunfish (pumpkinseed), swordfish, tilapia, tilefish, tuna (all varieties), turbot, whitefish (including smoked), whitefish and pike (store-bought), whiting
Fish fillet, grilled with lemon pepper

Fruit cocktail
Fruit cup, unsweetened
Fruit salad
Fruit, unsweetened

Garlic
Ginger root

Grapefruit
Grapes
Greens: beet, collard, dandelion, kale, mustard, turnip
Greens, mixed baby

Guavas
Guavas, strawberry

Hearts of palm (palmetto)
Honeydew melon
Jackfruit
Jerk chicken breast
Jerusalem artichokes (sunchokes)
Jicama (yam bean)

Kiwifruit
Kohlrabi
Kumquats

Leeks
Lemon

Lemon zest
Lentils
Lettuce, all varieties
Lime
Lime zest

Litchis (lychees)

Mangoes
Melon balls
Mung bean sprouts
Mung dal
Mushroom caps
Mushrooms: all varieties including brown, button, crimini, Italian, portabella, shiitake


Nectarine
Nori seaweed

Okra
Onions
Oranges: all varieties including blood

Papayas
Parsley
Passion fruit
Pea shoots
Peaches
Peapods, black-eye
Pears
Peas and carrots
Peas: black-eyed, chickpeas (garbanzo), cowpeas (blackeyes, crowder, southern), young pods with seeds, green, pigeon, snow (Chinese pea pods); split, sugar snap
Peppers, all varieties
Pepperoncini
Persimmons
Pickles, unsweetened
Pico de gallo
Pimientos, canned
Pineapple
Plumcots (pluots)
Plums
Pomegranate seeds
Pomegranates
Pomelo (pummelo)
Pumpkin
Pumpkin puree


Radicchio
Radishes
Raspberries

Rutabagas

Salad, mixed greens
Salad, side, without dressing, fast food

Salad, three-bean
Salad, tossed, without dressing
Salsa verde
Salsa, fat free
Salsa, fat free; gluten-free

Sashimi
Satay, chicken, without peanut sauce
Satsuma mandarin
Sauerkraut
Scallions
Seaweed
Shallots

Shellfish: abalone, clams, crab (including Alaska king, blue, dungeness, lump crabmeat, queen) crayfish, cuttlefish, lobster (including spiny lobster), mussels, octopus, oysters, scallops, shrimp, squid
Spinach

Sprouts, including alfalfa, bean, lentil
Squash, summer (all varieties including zucchini)
Squash, winter (all varieties including spaghetti)
Starfruit (carambola)
Strawberries
Succotash

Tangelo
Tangerine
Taro
Tofu, all varieties
Tofu, smoked
Tomatillos
Tomato puree
Tomato sauce
Tomatoes: all varieties including plum, grape, cherry
Turkey breast, ground, 99% fat-free
Turkey breast or tenderloin, skinless, boneless or with bone
Turkey breast, skinless, smoked
Turnips


Vegetable sticks
Vegetables, mixed
Vegetables, stir fry, without sauce

Water chestnuts
Watercress
Watermelon

Yogurt, Greek, plain, nonfat, unsweetened
Yogurt, plain, nonfat, unsweetened
Yogurt, soy, plain


As you can see, many of them are LC foods, and if you avoided the higher sugar fruit and the starchy veggies on that list, and stuck to only low carb foods on that list (without going overboard on the LC veggies), then used every single one of your points for added fats, you could do a LC version of WW these days. (somehow, I missed seeing the whole eggs when I first read the list - since those are free, that makes this version even more doable on LC) That was not the case a couple of years ago, when the only free food was fruit, and by the time you used a bunch of your points for LC friendly veggies and meats, any added fats cost far too many points to eat an adequate amount to do LC. I remember one LCer saying a while back that she did LC on WW for years, but finally had to quit WW when they basically starved her out by reallocating points on foods in such a way that she couldn't get enough LC food to continue.

One thing that really bothers me about WW is that they change it every year - what's free, what requires you spend your points, and reallocate how many points you're allotted, or how many points any individual food is worth. That's the furthest I can imagine from a lifetime way of eating, if you have to completely revamp your eating pattern every year, or at least figure out how to accommodate whatever changes they've instituted into your eating pattern. That's also one of the things I like most about LC - Even with all the different versions of LC out there, the principle stays the same - find your carb/protein/fat level, and stick to that unless you're not happy with the result, then (and only then) adjust as needed, not because some weight loss corporation told you that you had to do it their way.
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