What a combo!
Hi all...I'm glad to see such wonderful info out there! I have been a ovo-lacto (eats eggs and milk) vegan for 14 years now. I was diagnosed with PCOS 2 years ago. I was given glucophage and aldactone. All I can say that it did for me is help me gain 40 pounds. As soon as I stopped taking the meds, I started losing a little weight. Now, I've discovered that PCOS may be treated with a low-carb diet, which makes sense to me. I was wondering if someone may be able to help me with low-carbing for a vege information. All of the books I have looked at are really geared for "carnivores" ;-)
I've stopped eating bread, flour, sugar, sodas and the such so far...but, I'm running out of things to eat. I'm also wondering how many carbs I should get per day? Can I consume too few? What is the magic number of carbs for one day to lose weight and then maintain. Also, do carb blocker pills really work?

Sorry for all of the spew!!!!
Michele

Hi Webitgirl, welcome aboard.

Please don't take my question the wrong way, but, have you read any low-carb book? It is essential to read before doing it on your own, in addition to consulting your doctor.

We're here for you to cheer you on, but half the knowledge can be dangerous. Please borrow one from a library asap.

Browse the web site, particularly the "Tips" section for helpful hint.

Wa'il

Read the Carb Addicts book. It was almost completely geared to non-veggies, except for one tiny chapter. I also found that the book contridicted itself. If the book wasn't in storage, I'd give you the exact quotes. I highlighted them, of course. I'm looking for information that deals strictly with ova-lacto veggies, such as myself, and not the books that are geared to the "normal" people. Things like vegan low-carb diet plans, cookbooks, how to make tofu taste good ;-)

I have looked all over for vegan specific info, and am not finding any. I'm particularily interested in information related to PCOS and the ova-lacto vegan.

Thanks,
Michele

My daughter has PCOS, just diagnosed, and with this she is insulin resistant. There is a wonderful book called Insulin Resistance Diet, that I just bought. We have not tried, will start on Saturday ( The diet really makes sense. It limits carbs but you can have them as long as they are eaten with protein and veggies. I am excited by this program and even though there is not tons of info for vegetarians, we both are vegetarians) there is more than usual. Listing beans, eggs, lowfat cheese, soy proteins, as good protein sources. Good investment for $12.00. Has recipes, etc.

My daughter has PCOS, just diagnosed, and with this she is insulin resistant. There is a wonderful book called Insulin Resistance Diet, that I just bought. We have not tried, will start on Saturday ( The diet really makes sense. It limits carbs but you can have them as long as they are eaten with protein and veggies. I am excited by this program and even though there is not tons of info for vegetarians, we both are vegetarians) there is more than usual. Listing beans, eggs, lowfat cheese, soy proteins, as good protein sources. Good investment for $12.00. Has recipes, etc.

I am an insulin dependant diabetic and am also insulin resistant, I have also been a vegetarian for 15 years. Much of my vegetarian diet usually consisted of breads, pasta and potatoes. On that diet I was using 2500 mg of glucophage and 150-200 units of Humolog insulin per day -- this is a lot! In less than a week going low carb, I have been able to cut my glucophage requirements down to 500 mg twice a day and only 60 units of insulin a day. Since insulin is a fat storing hormone, the weight is coming off efortlessly. I have found going low-carb to be easy, it's easier for me not to eat the carbs at all than to eat a little and then try to stop at a reasonable amount. MOST vegetables are low-carb so you really shouldn't be concerned about getting bored. There is also a large variety of "meat" products made with vegetable proteins. And despite popular beleive, soy is not the only vegetable out there with protein and calcium. Although it is not specifically low-carb, I recommend reading Eat to Live by Joel Fuhrman. It has a lot of nutritional information in the book that helps to alleviate the concern many people have that you can't get proper nutrition without eating animal products. There is so much variety out there these days, don't worry about deficiencies, provided that you are willing to experiment with new foods so you don't eat the same thing over and over. I probably had more deiciencies before going low carb because my meals were so heavy in processed, high-carb foods that had little nutritional value. On the other hand, I've met so many low-carb meat eaters that rarely eat any vegetable products at all, they only eat meat and dairy, they should be worried about deficiencies.

quote: "And despite popular beleive, soy is not the only vegetable out there with protein and calcium."

Janellemd, lots of veggies contain calcium, but soybeans are a bean...a legume, to be precise. I agree that legumes, nuts and seeds, and spirulina algae are all good protein sources for vegetarians in the small quantities that low-carbing permits, but aside from them, which vegetables contain measurable amounts of protein that the human body can use? I am not aware of any...

Vital Wheat gluten, for example, is the processed protein part of wheat, and as such it's a great protein source for vegetarians who don't have wheat sensitivites--but whole wheat in any form doesn't have nearly the protein of VWG ounce for ounce...you'd have to eat a LOT of it to get the protein that you need, far more than a low carber's daily carb intake would permit.

Back to the original request for infomration--I'd take a look at Diana Schwarzbein's 'Schwarzbein Principle Vegetarian Cookbook,' Fred Pescatore's 'Thin for Good' book, which actually outlines a vegetarian low carb plan, and the the Eadeses' 'Protein Power Lifeplan,' which actually outlines the basic principles any low carber should understand (just skip the part where they really don't advise vegetarianism ). From that collection you should be able to construct a solid low carb vegetarian eating plan, based on the foods that you enjoy and the correct minimum protein recommendations as well as some carb intake guidelines.

Most green vegetables have protein (where do you think the cow gets it’s protein?). 100 calories of broccoli has MORE protein than 100 calories of steak. One cup of broccoli has 5.8 grams of protein and one cup of spinach has 5.4 grams (complete protein). Admittedly, one cup of tofu has 18 grams, which is why it is usually the first plant based source most people think of. I guess it all depends on how low-carb your specific diet plan is, but at 2 “non-fiber” carbs for the broccoli, you should be able to eat quite a bit. And by the way, contrary to popular belief, incomplete aminos do not have to be combined in the same meal (ie. Beans and rice together). Your body knows what to do with the pieces when it gets them.
Anyways, I've spouted enough numbers, I'll get off my soap box. Simply wanted to point out that soy is not the ONLY option for protein for those that don't particularly like soy.

Hi Michele. "Protein Power" is another veggie-friendly program.

If you have soy "meat" replacements available (assuming you like them), you don't have to be intimidated by those carnivorous recipes. Many of those products are LC - you just have to check the labels.

I have mild PCOS, and as long as I stay LC, it's completely under control. Good luck to you.

A cow's digestive system is *very* different from a human's--herbivore vs. omnivore, multiple stomachs versus our single stomach. A cow's multiple stomachs enable that animal to digest grasses (and grains) very differently and much more effectively than humans can. And while 'most green vegetables' contain *some* protein, only a very small percentage of the nutrients they contain are protein grams that your body can actually use. For reference, leather *also* contains protein, in fact it's nearly *all* protein (collagen) but that collagen protein isn't something that humans can digest and metabolize.



Just to make those numbers an apples-to-apples comparison, 100 calories of beef (about 1.3 oz, or a piece about 1" wide by 2.5" long by 1/2" thick, or about 1/3 of a BOCA burger) has 11g of protein that is nearly 80% utilizable by your body, and zero g carbs. 100 calories of fresh broccoli is about 5 CUPS of fresh chopped broccoli (10g ECC and 13g of protein, according to the USDA and Netzer's 'Food Counts' book, of which only about 4g of the protein, or about 1/3rd, is usable/metabolizable by humans according to the most up-to-date NPU charts.) 100 calories of frozen, cooked chopped broccoli is 2 CUPS (again, about 10g ECC and only 11g protein, of which only about 3.5g is usable protein.) Spinach numbers for protein digestion are similar--but 100 calories of fresh spinach is 10 CUPS chopped, and frozen spinach, cooked, is 2 1/2 CUPS.

Either way, I hope you're hungry--because that's a LOT of broccoli or spinach, and a lot of carbs, for a relatively small protein gain. They are fine foods, but they are NOT effective protein sources!



True--however, you do have to eat the complementary amino and essential fatty acids within the same digestive period (i.e., within about 4-5 hours of each other, depending on your metabolism). Otherwise, what your body does with the pieces that are incomplete and don't have appropriate partners is eliminate them, and they do you no good.



Absolutely correct. There are nuts, and seeds, and their butters and flours; legumes like lentils and chickpeas and their flours; even vital wheat gluten; and dairy and eggs if you eat those things. Kefir, a cultured milk that's like but thinner than yogurt, has 14g protein and only 12g carbs per cup. There are protein powders made from whey and rice (although rice is incomplete and should contain some complementary dairy). But green vegetables as a protein source, except for spirulina algae, really don't make it. The volume you'd need to eat to provide you with 0.5g protein per pound of lean body mass would be appetite killing--to use another visual example, it would be kinda like that commercial where 40 bowls of Special K provide the same vitamin profile as one bowl of Total cereal. Green veggies are vital to getting our vitamins and minerals, but they are really only an accessory to our main vegetarian protein sources.

Just found out on another thread about a new book coming out this month (August, 2004) called "The Low Carb Vegetarian" by Margo Demello. Maybe you would want to check that out.

I have PCOS, diagnosed about 12 years ago, and under the supervision of an endocrinologist, I ate a very low carb diet (less than 20 g carbs per day) for 3.5 years which ended up hurting me. After my metabolism straightened out and nothing would take the wieght off, I decided to become a vegetarian again. I was looking up how to be a vegetarian and eat low carb and found that the FDA has done research on PCOS and it recommends the Zone diet for it and the Soy Zone for vegetarians.

Since I started it, some of the side effects of PCOS have lessened (hirsutism, cramping) and I have been steadily been losing weight. I had been on Weight Watchers for a while but after losing about 10% of my body wieght, I held the same weight for about 2 years even though I rarely went off the diet. I'm hoping that the Soy Zone continues to work. I have not had sugar or meat for a very long time so, to me, the recipes taste great because my taste buds have had a chance to adjust. I triple the recipes and then freeze them in half servings (so I get six servings out of each batch) and that has been working well and makes it easy to take them to work.

Hope this helps!