I hate to say this, Im still struggling at this way of life and eating. stuggling to get enough calories in, struggling to find solid, good sources of Vitamins A & D that I can rely on everyday, struggling with going to the store EVery day just to get more food, going thru so much money.
Im losing the little weight that I have and some of my muscle mass that I 've worked so hard to keep up.. I know I'm doing my body a terrible disservice by doing this, im practically starving my body.
I'll have a few eggs in a day, ok then a little later I'll have some shellfish, maybe an 8oz filet of salmon, thats pretty much it.
Even the dairy that I keep bringing up is not "super" good in those fat soluble vitamins, 1 cup only has less than 10% Vitamin A so even raw dairy is not an excellent source of these vitamins.
I'm doing very well on the Brain part of this way of life though, I don't get/give in to cravings, I'm deadset on following this and I'm determined, It'd be so much easier if I could get a plan down each day and get a nice routine going so I can start gaining weight and actually getting more than 500 calories in per day. Some of these days I'm not even eating 400 calories, some days I'll only have around 700 and im a damn teenage guy, i need as much as I can get.
The fatty roasts like Capo suggested sounded nice at first, but on learning about nutrients roasts don't have the fat soluble A & D vitamins, and I'm not being obsessed like every food needsto have a certain amount but Im not going to waste my time with roasts if they dont have Any of the fat soluble vitamins.
Hoping some of the amazing posters here who give me so much info can help me out and get me on the right path

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Dude...seriously. What's going on? This WOE is dead easy. You are sounding orthorexic (sp?) here. Please, sweetie, deep breath.



Why are you eating so little? Seriously, why? EAT.



So get some cod liver oil. Eat liver once a week. Lots of cultures in the world do without dairy, I don't know why you insist on eating it if it causes you problems. I say this respectfully, but forcefully.



Have you read Neanderthin or Paleo Diet? Or you could try a plan something
like: When hungry, eat shitload of animal protein and fat and vegetation (if you eat it) until no longer hungry.



Again I must ask...why? Is it a financial issue?



You are being obsessed, like every food needs to have a certain amount of fat soluble vitamins. Look, we don't live in a perfect world. We do the best we can with what we've got. Get yourself some good quality cod liver oil at least, and get busy EATING. You are going to make yourself ill. Health is more important that some dietary ideal - just ask a breatharian

Edited to add: sounds like you're buying the expensive proteins (seafood...I know here, salmon is pricey). Now I'm assuming you want to get the vitamins from the seafood...any Asian markets near you? Lots of little dried shrimps, etc, that can be made into pastes; also seaweed can be added to fish stock for lots of trace minerals (ask at the fish counter if they have any heads, tails, carcasses, shells etc and make broth with it) and prolly the dried fishies, but I think they're pretty strong tasting. Anyway, you can condense a lot of vitamins into a fish broth, and fairly cheaply. Although they say not to use oily fish, I've used bagged whole sardines with shrimp shells to make very yummy broth.

Jayppers I already read your post before you edited it. You are totally right I'm being very complain-y and ungrateful, I should be happy I can even pick what meats I want to eat and whether I want this type of meat or that type of meat.
I seem to come across as some little spoiled kid in my posts who is unthankful and I can understand why you guys are saying these things to me.
I am being too obsessive about the fat soluble vitamins, you guys are right about that too haahaa. I'll get a good routine down and going and then I can come back in a few weeks and complain after it really means something haahaa.

Wayward, the reason Im not eating much is so complex. The issues change everyday.. Usually it's because I'm not hungry enough, or I just cant make it to the store that night to get more meat. I guess I cant say Im not complaining because I am right now, but it Is really difficult for me sometimes to get the food to my house. Meats are something you need to buy on a daily basis, every 2 or 3 days whatever, so Im always at the store, plus my ideas about this lifestyle change almost daily, something im working on, so some days Im paying a lot for roasts and others Im eating more seafood...The grassfed meat is expensive, so sometimes i'd rather just stick with seafood and eggs for a few days then go back to supermarket meat. The eggs I have all day usually 6-8 (don't know if thats too little or too many, like i said what i know about this WOE changes almost daily and what im learning), those are good calorie-dense foods for me.. Im keeping the dairy out, the liver is either daily or every 2 to 3 days, but very small portions.
I apologize for my negative energy, it really makes this thread more complain-y and thats my fault, I'll stop

Hey, meatzrus, buddy!

You're adjusting to a new way of eating -- one in which hunger isn't the same as a higher carb diet, which I would assume you were eating your whole life up to this point. theBear himself said that he has to remind himself to eat most of the time because he never feels hungry -- you should do the same.

Set an amount of meat that would be appropriate for you calorically and stick with it! Try to eat like 3000 calories/day and see how you feel. The bulk of these calories should be fat -- develop your fat tooth!

I had to eat a lot of fatty meat to gain significant muscle weight. Don't worry about the A & D -- just eat liver once in a while, and take some cod liver oil. I eat a lot of egg yolks, which seem to have adequate amounts of needed nutrients. I go by my body's needs.

It may take time for your body to learn how to utilize and crave meat/fat, but you'll get there. Just feed yourself well!

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rk900, do you know anything about supplements versus getting all your nutrients naturally from food? I'm wondering if maybe I might become deficient in some nutrient eating mostly fatty meat, bone broths, egg yolks, and once or twice a week liver. I'm not a fan of supplements (unless they're natural and not synthetically made).

Meatzrus, I'm glad you accepted my post and agreed with my statements. I felt they were inappropriate after posting them b/c I thought they would be viewed as me not providing support, which is what this forum is about; However, after further consideration, I think my post would have been OK, because I was trying to help you by giving you the proverbial kick in the #$%.

Anyway. I personally think that you should stop trying to go for the grass-fed stuff ALL of the time. I do not think that you should fear supermarket meat - AT ALL! I eat supermarket meat ALL THE TIME and I am completely carnivorous. IMO, supermarket meat is not harmful like many promote it to be. Grass-fed is great, when you can afford it, comfortably, but you have to get over your brainwashing that supermarket meat is bad - it's fine for you to eat, IN LARGE QUANTITIES! I'm not a Christian, but I think this page is interesting - myths, lies, and distortions about beef ... Take at look at it and see what I'm talking about.

Lastly, don't worry about your portion sizes so much. Eat until you are full and content! Don't over obsess about how many eggs your eating or how many ounces of seafood your eating. Eat until you are pleasantly full (not gorged, of course) and you don't feel hungry or deprived any longer. I would try to stick to 3 meals a day and just find the plan and routine that works best for you. 500 - 700 calories a day is NOT ACCEPTABLE for a growing teenager such as yourself. You should be eating like at least 2000 calories a day, if not more. It eating more means having to purchase supermarket meat, so bet it, what is the big deal? MEAT IS GOOD. FATTY MEAT IS BETTER! Don't go hungry!

Oh, and truly lastly, don't you have a freezer? You don't have to go to the market/grocery store every day or so. When you go, buy lots of meat! Usually the fattier the cut, the cheaper, so buy lots of fatty meats and load up your freezer with some and enough to last you a few days in the fridge. Then, as you pull some out of the fridge, pull some down from the freezer to make sure it has plenty of time to defrost (usually 1 1/2 days or 2) This way you won't have to make so many exhausting trips to the market. It's no wonder you're struggling with this. You've gotta incorporate some simple conveniences into this change, and going to the grocery every few days is for the birds.

Koch and Waywardsis have great points as well. Hope things improve for you soon! Good luck.

You guys thank you that is such good advice, I never thought about the freezer/freezing meats idea thats a good idea.
Rk, you've put on muscle mass? i remember reading something about you having gained 20 something pounds but i must've read over it too fast, did you seriously gain that much in pure muscle, just from eating more? thats great seriously amazing, i see good times ahead for me haahaa..
Fatty roasts will definitely become a new part of my daily eating habits now, hot damn the prices at Vons market are out of this world, i can buy like 3 sets of roasts for under 15 dollars?!?!?!!? supermarket meat prices are sooooooooo goood now i have reason to eat lots of meat instead of fretting about the expensive grassfed beef and trying to save what little amount of the beef i actually had..
again, you guys are gonna get mad at me for repeating it so much haaa you guys really are amazing in the info you give and how you respond with such long, thought-provoking, inspirational, you can tell you put a lot of time into what you write and thats a good quality

Hey Meatz - I totally get you on the grass-fed=pricey thing. I buy it when I can, but don't sweat it when I can't.

Buy some cod liver oil - it's great stuff, lots of A and D. Well, more A than D. I get obsessed too...that's why I called you on it bc I recognize it I am currently obsessing over in the nutrition/supplements forum.

Glad to hear you're gonna eat! You need it, and you'll feel better. Just get a good base going, get to a point where you feel good and healthy. You can always tweak things later.

You're such a sweetie and so open to advice...good for you.

I thought i'd say to everyone thank you so much again for all you've taught me and for always responding with such detailed answers. im leaving this forum, pretty much the internet all together, its doing me no good, only harming me. ever since ive gotten into/cared about what im eating, the internet has fueled all my sorrow. Listening and believing everything i read, taking other people's experiences and advice and applying it to me, not good at all.

I need to thank Weston Price for showing me that all meat is definitely not the way to go.. I know ive posted on this thread alot about how meat is definitely something that promotes proper bone development, but seriously after reading thru all his studies and looking at the pictures, it makes no sense. i keep boring you guys/annoying you with the same statements and the same questions but seriously it doesnt make sense at all. There are the Swiss who only eat meat once a week or less, they also eat whole rye BREAD?!?!? they looked properly developed to me, then there are the Kikuyus who i keep bringing up, they eat no meat, yet BAM look at their structures even more beautiful than the Eskimoes who eat pretty much all meat and fat, yet they dont eat meat. so what im taking away from this is not that meat is the best food, but that WHOLE foods are the key here, whole, natural foods, not refined in anyway. the reason i think this is because the swiss ate whole rye bread but they didn't exhibit the same symptoms as the other tribes who ate whitemans food.

so again i just wanted to thank the people who really taught me stuff and helped me along. i really have no idea where i'll end up, hopefully this cycle will soon end and ican just enjoy life, something i havent really done since i was 12, and im 17 so i should be enjoying things.
i need to give advice to other people who might be unfortunately following in my footsteps, confused about eating and eating lifestyles and utterly lost and confused.
remember, No one knows Anything about Anything!!!!! everything someone says can be contradicted and proven false by the next poster, always remember that, so Never believe anything you read. if i would've known this 6 months ago i might be way better off.. alright goodbye guys, i hope i find a good path to follow andi hope i find happiness in my WOE soon

I'm sorry you didn't have any success with the carnivorous WOE. Perhaps you didn't give it enough time and weren't eating enough. I'm completely happy eating carnivorously, so I don't really understand why you're having so much trouble. And in relation to why Eskimos and Africans and Swiss have different looking bone facial structures, it's due to many factors, such as genes, climate, weather, sunlight exposure, and adaptability to all of these things. All of the Weston Price tribes have specifically adapted to live in the climate they live in, and just because they differ in appearance does not make them any less healthy. The Eskimos in fact have very close to no cancer, heart disease, or other diseases and illnesses, just like the Swiss and Africans. Therefore, calling one race better because they appear structurally different is kind of silly to me. They are that way for a reason. I think the Eskimos look like they have awesome jawlines and dental arches (they'd look even better if they didn't chew up all that sand in their food that makes their teeth so worn). But in any case, all of the successful tribes and uncivilized societies had high fat diets high in natural animal fat. Perhaps one or two less superior African tribes used vegetation as part of their diet, but most of modern vegetation is so adulterated with pesticides, mishandling, and genetic altering that it's nutritionally worthless anyway.

capo, you completely misinterpreted and misunderstood my post. i don't know why you took it that way..
I was expressing the opposite of what you are saying, the very fact that all those tribes have similar bone structures is what gets to me, I never said the tribes had different facial structures. That's whats so amazing and hard to understand for me. The Eskimoes, Kikuyu, and Swiss for example all have strong and sturdy facial structures, and they look similar to me, in the sense that they all have a sculpted facial structure look. Yet they have completely different diets, at one end the Eskimoes with all meat/fat, at the other end the Kikuyus with no meat and all vegetation. So it's the simply fact that they all have similar facial structures, strong and robust, yet their diets differ completely.
That is the main reason I'm not going to continue eating this WOE, so I thank Weston Price's studies for steering me away from all meat.
I am still going to follow in this type of lifestyle of course, I just need to add back in some carby paleolithic foods like maybe some sweet potatoes and raw honey.
What's so weird about the Paleolithic diet is they say you should eat high fat, but where is there fat to eat from then if you're eating paleo, because they exclude dairy?!? Are they implying to eat all your fat from nuts?
I have one last question if anyone has any experience in this, how is raw honey? Anyone consume raw honey and like the results, whatever they may be?

The simple truth is all the tribes/uncivilized societies got all their needed nutrition. The modern diet fad doesn't stress nutrition enough, saying a few carrots or an apple or a bunch of broccoli will give you the nutritients your body needs to grow/heal, and it's a lie. I can't believe you don't understand how nutrient-dense animal products are.. :-? It's amazing that after almost 200 posts in this thread that you don't get that animal products are the highest nutrient dense food out there that you can access. Vegetation is a joke compared to beef and beef liver. TBH, you probably weren't eating enough fatty meat and thought something must have been wrong, but if you eat eat eat fatty meat, your body is going to gain muscle bone and fat to have a robust/healthy appearance. Humans weren't meant to be ultra-slim vegetarians who seldom ate and didn't get proper nutrition. That part of the gene pool died off about a million years ago. And I've had honey and nuts. Honey would be way way way too sweet for me now. It's repulsing actually, and nuts are okay in small amounts. The best nuts to eat are macadamians because they're mostly all saturated and monounsaturated (the good fats) fat. The nuts high in polyunsaturated fats are bad to consume in large quantities because pufas are linked to cancer/heart disease, and probably a multitude of other fatal diseases.