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  #16   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 06:35
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
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Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
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Progress: 129%
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Quote:
Originally Posted by M Levac
So, how does metformin work? It activates insulin receptors. In doing so, this means insulin is now more potent. This is probably good at the liver, where insulin is degraded, hence the claimed drop of insulin in peripheral tissue. But everywhere else, it just makes things worse, especially at the fat tissue, especially when there's already too much insulin floating around, ya?


A compelling point. If it follows the usual path of 20th century "miracle" drugs, it might turn out to be like statins: miracle workers about getting "those numbers" on a lab test to go down, but working in unknown ways to mess things up.
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  #17   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 06:39
WereBear's Avatar
WereBear WereBear is offline
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Plan: EpiPaleo/Primal/LowOx
Stats: 220/130/150 Female 67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mike_d
Rapamycin [Everolimus, Afinitor or Sirolimus] is another drug gaining traction among the "healthspan" crowd. Inhibition of mTOR, the molecular target of everolimus, extends the lifespan of model organisms including mice, and mTOR inhibition has been suggested as an anti-aging therapy. A study is under way in Seattle to see if rapamycin extends the lives of pet dogs.

The side effects will curl your hair -- I would rather die early.

https://www.technologyreview.com/s/...en-waiting-for/



Didn't see any side effects? This:

Quote:
Rapamycin acts on what is called the mTOR complex, a set of genes that play a basic role in regulating the metabolism of cells. When mTOR is blocked, it can push cells into a life-extending survival mode. So can a variety of other tricks, including feeding animals a very low-calorie diet. “But this happens to be one mechanism that is actionable with a drug and not, say, calorie restriction,” says Bolen. “I think this is a practical way to go about the modulation. What the biology tells you is that what was observed in many other species looks as though it is going to hold in humans.”


Oh, calorie restriction! Unless you put us in cages, it won't work!

And didn't it turn out that CARB restriction has the same effects without the torment?

Kind of like "dieting" itself?
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  #18   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 07:10
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teaser teaser is offline
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Plan: mostly milkfat
Stats: 190/152.4/154 Male 67inches
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Location: Ontario
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Metformin might increase insulin signalling--or at least the amount of successful signalling at a given insulin level--but if it were preventative versus development of fatty liver, obesity, or otherwise versus development of insulin resistance, the lifetime exposure to insulin might go down. Also I think some cautiion is always advisable when working from mechanisms on up to predicting outcomes.

That said, a drug that improves glucose metabolism in the sick does seem less likely to benefit a person with an uncompromised glucose metabolism. The most studied intervention for for longevity is probably still calorie restriction, and that generally works in animals prone to developing insulin resistance and obesity, that are fed diets that promote these.
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  #19   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 12:29
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s93uv3h s93uv3h is offline
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Plan: Atkins & IF / TRE
Stats: 000/000/000 Male 5' 10"
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speaking of non-alcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD)...

Fatty Liver Disease and Ketogenic Diets

Lack of Saturated Fat Consumption: At least two studies, one from Duke University, and one from Cambridge University have shown that reducing carbohydrate consumption and increasing saturated fat intake helps the liver shed excess fat in as little as three days.


no drug needed.

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  #20   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 13:16
Meme#1's Avatar
Meme#1 Meme#1 is offline
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Plan: Atkins DANDR
Stats: 210/194/160 Female 5'4"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s93uv3h
speaking of non-alcoholic fatty liver disease (NAFLD)...

Fatty Liver Disease and Ketogenic Diets

Lack of Saturated Fat Consumption: At least two studies, one from Duke University, and one from Cambridge University have shown that reducing carbohydrate consumption and increasing saturated fat intake helps the liver shed excess fat in as little as three days.


no drug needed.



Thank you for posting this!! No less than 30 seconds before I was about to go on the hunt to research NAFLD. DD3 on the hunt to figure out what has been wrong with her and gong from doctor to doctor just went to a doctor who is diagnosing her with this at the age of only 26 years old!
Perfect timing!
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  #21   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 13:44
s93uv3h's Avatar
s93uv3h s93uv3h is offline
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Posts: 1,662
 
Plan: Atkins & IF / TRE
Stats: 000/000/000 Male 5' 10"
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Meme#1
Thank you for posting this!! No less than 30 seconds before I was about to go on the hunt to research NAFLD. DD3 on the hunt to figure out what has been wrong with her and gong from doctor to doctor just went to a doctor who is diagnosing her with this at the age of only 26 years old!
Perfect timing!
Awesome!

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  #22   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 20:48
Zei Zei is offline
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Plan: Carb reduction in general
Stats: 230/185/180 Female 5 ft 9 in
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So mTOR stands for mammalian target of rapamycin. Because that's what rapamycin targets, that is, down-regulates. Shut down mTOR, make humans live longer? Maybe. Future studies might be done and find that to be the case. BUT... mTOR is also the nutrient sensing system that when activated tells the body to grow and repair muscle. If an aging body's not getting that signal regularly by stimulating mTOR with exercise, protein, etc., sarcopenia (age-related muscle wasting) rears its ugly head. Visions of muscular weakness and resulting frailty, loss of abilities and independence, falls that disable or kill because the muscles were too weak for proper balance. Leading to possibly a long life span but short health span? Something to consider.
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  #23   ^
Old Fri, Sep-07-18, 22:53
Meme#1's Avatar
Meme#1 Meme#1 is offline
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Posts: 12,456
 
Plan: Atkins DANDR
Stats: 210/194/160 Female 5'4"
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Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zei
So mTOR stands for mammalian target of rapamycin. Because that's what rapamycin targets, that is, down-regulates. Shut down mTOR, make humans live longer? Maybe. Future studies might be done and find that to be the case. BUT... mTOR is also the nutrient sensing system that when activated tells the body to grow and repair muscle. If an aging body's not getting that signal regularly by stimulating mTOR with exercise, protein, etc., sarcopenia (age-related muscle wasting) rears its ugly head. Visions of muscular weakness and resulting frailty, loss of abilities and independence, falls that disable or kill because the muscles were too weak for proper balance. Leading to possibly a long life span but short health span? Something to consider.


OMG that doesn't sound good at all!! Muscle wasting because it shut down the body's ability to regulate nutrients to grow and repair muscle?

ps I was just telling DH about this and it made me think that it would also include the heart muscles not repairing themselves, that's very concerning!
Better to go low carb!!

Last edited by Meme#1 : Fri, Sep-07-18 at 23:00.
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  #24   ^
Old Sat, Sep-08-18, 20:56
Zei Zei is offline
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Posts: 1,596
 
Plan: Carb reduction in general
Stats: 230/185/180 Female 5 ft 9 in
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Low carb, good. But beware a possible popular mistake while doing keto of going too low on protein. It takes 2.5 grams of the amino acid leucine to temporarily upregulate mTOR to stimulate muscle building, which is typically found in around 30 grams of animal-sourced protein (closer to 60 from plants due to lower leucine levels). If you're aging plus limiting protein so that only say one meal out of your day hits this mark or maybe your protein is divided out so each meal is at a level too low to stimulate mTOR, you may think you're getting plenty enough protein but muscles aren't being stimulated to grow. I've upped my protein per meal based on this information from Dr. Gabrielle Lyon. Her website here https://www.drgabriellelyon.com/ for anyone interested.
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  #25   ^
Old Sun, Sep-09-18, 06:07
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cotonpal cotonpal is online now
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Posts: 5,312
 
Plan: very low carb real food
Stats: 245/125/135 Female 62
BF:
Progress: 109%
Location: Vermont
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zei
Low carb, good. But beware a possible popular mistake while doing keto of going too low on protein. It takes 2.5 grams of the amino acid leucine to temporarily upregulate mTOR to stimulate muscle building, which is typically found in around 30 grams of animal-sourced protein (closer to 60 from plants due to lower leucine levels). If you're aging plus limiting protein so that only say one meal out of your day hits this mark or maybe your protein is divided out so each meal is at a level too low to stimulate mTOR, you may think you're getting plenty enough protein but muscles aren't being stimulated to grow. I've upped my protein per meal based on this information from Dr. Gabrielle Lyon. Her website here https://www.drgabriellelyon.com/ for anyone interested.


I've also upped my protein intake.

Here's an interview with Dr Stuart Philips on the importance of protein especially as we age:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1_MXKahAtAo&t=2s

Dr Ted Naiman talks about the importance of protein also:

https://www.dietdoctor.com/too-much...than-too-little
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  #26   ^
Old Sun, Sep-09-18, 10:43
GRB5111's Avatar
GRB5111 GRB5111 is offline
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Posts: 4,044
 
Plan: Very LC, Higher Protein
Stats: 227/186/185 Male 6' 0"
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Progress: 98%
Location: Herndon, VA
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As mentioned in other posts, I've also upped my protein intake and combined it with a more active fitness routine of walking, hiking, running, HIIT, and Pilates. Lately, I've noticed I have put on a few pounds, but my clothes are slightly looser. This is my unscientific way of presuming the additional weight is increased lean mass. That's what I'm trying to do as I get older and, in the process, feeling better.
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  #27   ^
Old Sun, Sep-09-18, 14:53
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Ms Arielle Ms Arielle is offline
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Plan: atkins, carnivore 2023
Stats: 200/211/163 Female 5'8"
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Progress: -30%
Location: Massachusetts
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Way to go!!! My grandfather was carrying a new tv into his house in his mid 90's !!
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