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Old Sun, Apr-12-09, 22:02
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awriter awriter is offline
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Posts: 1,096
 
Plan: Kwasniewski Ratios
Stats: 225/158/145 Female 65
BF:53%/24%/20%
Progress: 84%
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Originally Posted by deirdra
One month? I've been following his advice, with tweaks to avoid gluten, casein & soy, for four years.

This is great - now you can be the Guru!

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I think you'll find that you may need to tweak it too, over time. The protein levels may be fine for sedentary people, but for those carrying around a lot of extra weight (not you), or doing a lot of exercise or manual labour, that a "normal"-framed person may need to use the larger frame size as a guide (when first starting out, since every step is like heavy weight lifting), and a bed-ridden normal-frame person may do better using the "small" frame size (since these are only variables that Calculus Victus lets you change easily).

You may be right about the tweaking, but before I tweak I tend to try a recipe straight the first time. I needed to discover if after a two-year scale weight stall, this would really work for me. And I didn't want to have to wonder if it was the tweaking right off the bat that made it fail, if it failed. And believe me, I will be watching the protein levels carefully. I've worked too hard too long to build these biceps, so if I'm not eating enough protein for my activity level I'll know right away.

But there's another reason I decided to try this to begin with. Recent studies indicate that some folks who are insulin resistant, like me, simply cannot process protein in the face of high fat (and I think it's safe to call most LC diets that, even if they're not as high as K) the way normal people do. More of that protein than is proper gets turned to glucose, calls up an abnormal insulin response, and stores too much of it as body fat. And I believe those people (mostly women it seems), are the very ones who have good initial success with LC and then just . . . stop. No matter what they do.

I am definitely one of those people. I suspect Debbie is (from what she's shared about herself) is too. So even though we can tweak, and can do large frame and can do +10% -- I'm not sure that wouldn't ultimately cause us to either lose less weight than we would on K, or lose a tiny bit and then stall again. I believe really low protein for us is the way to go --- at least initially, so that we can become less insulin resistant over time. Keeping the fat and calories way up, with protein very low (and maybe lower than it strictly has to be) will keep me from being hungry, and may even finally heal my very abused metabolism.

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Tweaking carbs may also be necessary, depending on how carb-sensitive you are (more than 40g net sends me on a BG roller coaster, but then more than 20g net takes me out of ketosis). The very high fat levels have been the key to my success, after 35 years of HC & LC failures. Like you, I was shocked to find that eating more fat (& 1900-2000 calories), rather than cutting back (below my 1350-1450 cal "diet" levels), was what got my metabolism moving & normalizing, something I had never thought possible. I was planning to give up dieting entirely until I decided to try one last approach that I'd never tried - more food & more fat!

Amen, Sister! How much scale weight and body fat (clothing sizes, I guess) have you lost in these 4 years? How many protein grams per day do you eat in maintenance? I do agree about watching the carbs, but my tendency is to eat low anyway. On nearly 1700 calories today my net carb count is 34.4 - but I can't eat much lower because I go into ketosis at the drop of a hat, or maybe I should say by ingesting that extra spoonful of whipped cream.

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Dr. K's Polish website tells you to not to count vegetal protein toward P

That's interesting. My cream, coconut cream, fish and meat protein grams today were only 39, but my veggie protein added another 11, for a total of 50. That feels quite comfortable, but it's nice to know I can eat as much veggie as I want (I do love them, but have been very parsimonious this last month because of the protein count!) and the occasional steak and still be okay. Can you post a link here to the actual site? I can run it through Google Translation and see what it says and how it differs from the English one run by his fan in S.A.

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all his charts show total carbs (not net carbs), so I've always assumed that is part of why his (and Barry Groves') carb allotments are higher than the Eades' or Atkins' post-2001.

Ah . . . but in Europe all listed 'total' carbs ARE net carbs. That's how their food labeling differs from ours. They've already deducted the fiber. I lived in Europe for many years, and it took me a while to get used to it. So in this case the reason they're higher than Atkins or Eades is - they are actually higher.

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Other than eating 300-500 more calories of fat per day, my net carbs and animal protein levels are very similar to what I was eating on PPLP, but being frugal, I never ate huge amounts of animal protein.

Hmm. I did. Like many others I thought 'great, the one thing I can eat lots and lots of' -- maybe because you didn't you didn't develop the same problem accumulation of Branched Protein Amino Acids.

Thanks for sharing so much good info!

Lisa
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