No, I'm not looking for a sharp demarcation of states at all. As I said, I see it as a continuum of conditions. But even so, there are terms and descriptions that are used to describe various ranges along that continuum. The boundaries are not precise, I would be surpised if they were.

What I'm trying to gain an understanding of is what the basic order of things is. For instance, I know that, at some point, a diabetic starts metabolizing fat. I know that, at some point, their blood sugar starts rising. I know that, at some point, they start dumping sugar into their urine. I don't for a moment believe (could be wrong) that any of these are some kind of immediate on/off switch behavior. I would expect them to be gradual and progressive. But I would also expect for there to generally be an order that is followed.

For instance, would a T2 diabetic normally start metabolizing fat before their BG's have risen at all? My present thinking is that this would be unlikely - I would expect their BG's to start rising first and well before fat metabolism begins. But what about starting to dump sugar into the urine? Does this normally begin before any significant fat metabolism has started, or is fat metabolism usually well underway before sugar starts getting dumped into the urine, or are they completely unrelated. In other words, if you had two patients (neither of whom are low carbing) and all you knew was that Bob was dumping a little higher than normal sugar and Joe was dumping a little higher than normal ketones (and every other cause except diabetes related stuff is assumed to be ruled out), would you have any basis to suspect that Bob is probably dumping ketones or that Joe is probably dumping sugar? Similarly, if all you knew was that Bob was NOT dumping sugar and that Joe was NOT dumping ketones, would that give reason to suspect that Bob is also probably not dumping ketones or that Joe is probably not dumping sugar? Or does know the result of one test, be it positive or negative, give no indication as to the probably positive or negative state of the other test?

I'm not asking so that I can "push it". That's not my motivation at all. Nor am I particularly concerned about knowing what precisely was going on with me before I was diagnosed - I was simply using that as a specific example. I'm just trying to gain a better understanding of some of the finer points of this disease.

One point that I am still very unclear on - the other poster, Dina, has twice said that she thought that a T2 with very high BG levels would be undergowing gluconeogenesis and burning protein. That, based on my present very incomplete understanding, seems unlikely. Am I wrong? Does the liver of a T2 patient commonly convert protein to glucose even more as their BG's rise to very high levels? If so, is there a reason why the body would be doing this? I could see something along the following lines - there is insufficient insulin for the glucose to get into the cells and the cells only know that they aren't getting glucose to burn, so they sucrete hormones, enzymes, or what have you that trigger the liver to start converting protein to glucose. That seems unlikely, given that the cells (or something) are able to start switching over to a fat metabolism instead. But I don't know and am curious.