antidepressants, chronic illness and low carbing

[eurydice]

Hello, I'm new and this is my first post. I haven't started the diet yet-well I tried going on the Scasrdale, which I could do before for 2 weeks no problem-thi stime I couldnt' even do it for one day. The craving for sweets was so bad. Now, I have a few questions, if anyone could help, I would appreciate it very much. First of all, right now I'm on amitriptyline-I know this makes you gain weight. The problem is, it seems all antidepressants do. So which one should I try? I've tried wellbutrin-couldnt' breathe. I also could'nt breathe on 50mcg of l-thyroxine(synthroid). My thyroid is borderline hypo-6-8 TSH-it fluctuates, but since I can't take the pills-I dont' know what I'm supposed to do about that. I have been chronically ill for over four years now. All my tests come up "normal". I'm exhausted, muscle pain, brain fog, can't work, can't sleep, reflux everyday(bring up food), weakness, bad skin, hair loss, dry eyes, problem going to the bathroom etc. I've seen an endocrinologist-everything's "normal" hormone wise-except a low cortisol, but when they stimulated it-it was "normal"-case closed. I'm at least 40 pounds overweight.Anyway, What antidepressant would you recommend for least weight gain and what the heck do you do about really bad cravings for sweets. I've got will power-I've quit smoking, drinking, and a lot of other things-this use to be far less of a problem-but like I said-I couldn't even stick to Scarsdale for one day! I think I have CFS, noise bothers me, smells bother me-heck-everything bothers me! ;) I would like to try low carbing. Thank you for this message board-sorry for the long post.

[eurydice]

Hi again, I read over my post and I thought that Iit looked like I haven't read the other posts. I have read through this thread. I just wondered if anyone had experience with an antidepressant where they didn't gain weight, or not very much. About the cravings, obviously a person just has to tough it out, but I wondered if anyone found anything that might help with that. I know that lowcarbing is a way of life and not a diet and I want to start. I've started reading Dr.Atkins book, and I read the scarsdale book, but I don't know if that is considered lowcarbing. I'll look around the site and look into the different plans. I just wondered for now about the antidepressant , as I have an appointment with my doctor to change from amitriptyline to something else. Thanks.

[liberty]

Hi eurydice,
I wrote u a really long reply yesterday ....then lost it thanks to my husband ......who was trying to be helpful!

So i'll keep it shorter today!

I empathise with your plight as a fellow me/cfs sufferer......if u need to check whether u have me/cfs there r some very good sites on the net. There are also sites re: antidepressants and weight gain.....worth having a look.

I'm also hypo thyroid and take armour thyroid and doing very well on it.

In regards to a low carb diet the first 2 weeks were hell for me but i stuck it out as i knew it was withdrawal............I had bad depression as my serotonin levels plummeted......but that was me not necc that that will be your experience.

I now take St johns wort (herbal antidepressant)to support my serotonin levels....and now i'm getting used to low carbing my energy (what little i have )is far more stable......and eventually my serotonin levels will normalise in time.

I would recommend the schwarzbein principle as a good read re healing your metaboloism she also mentions the use of antidepressants and what they do to your metabolism.

Which ever plan u choose to follow it is worth it .........my ME/CFS CONSULTANT RECOMMENDS A LOW CARB DIET and she is the medical consultant to ACTION FOR ME......she even does it herself!

If u need to ask me anything email me if u like.


Liberty x

I

[eurydice]

Hey Liberty, Thanks for your reply. Forgive my ignorance, but I looked at your profile and don't know how to email you. Thanks for pointing me in a beginning direction. I'm going to check out the Schwarzbein Principle from the library today. I'm really curious about the armour thyroid you mentioned, I've never heard of it. I'll look it up. I hope that whatever it is, there's something like it in Canada. Thanks again! I really like this board. It's a good feeling to know that there's other people who feel like I do, but who've gotten some kind of relief. I've been going out of my mind.

[brycielan]

I know not everyone is the same, or going through the same problems. But I've been through the antidepressant search and still go through the chronic pain and sheer frustration!

Sweet cravings are hard, I still get them even being an LCer. Usually at 10 at night. However, I don't ignore them, I find something with a little sugar and some fiber in them so my head doesn't ache from eating it. And I don't eat a lot of it, just enough to put that craving to rest.

As for antidepressants. I was on wellbutrin then they pushed me up to serzone. Regardless (and this is why I say everyone's different) it didn't do anything but make me worse. I went radical and bucked the system going in for vitamin and mineral IV therapy with an alternative doctor and my depression was gone in two weeks.

What kind of vitamins are you taking? What kinds of foods do you eat? Those can make a big difference in how you feel. When I feel like absolute crap and the world sucks, that's when I want sugar... really, really bad.

As for which WOL... :D I switch around to see which one suits me. I did Atkins ages ago and hated it because it was so restrictive. A few months ago I started back again with Schwarzbien (which I'm basically doing now, but modified). And I've read most of the books on LCing. It has helped me, I found I feel better when I eat this way. And I try to do some kind of exercising when I don't hurt a lot. That helps too.

Search around and try different ones out and see what works best for you and makes you happy. Stress is a big factor in our health. And not being happy causes stress.

Welcome and good luck in your search. Help is always here when you need it.

- Bry

[eurydice]

Hello Brycielan, thanks for your post. As far as the foods I eat. I usually wake up pretty late because I'm up and down all night-every night, so I get up, I have 2 cups of coffee with cream and sugar at around 11:00 or noon. Then I don't eat until supper. But I'm not hungry and sometimes I even feel sick enough so I can't eat. Yes-I know this is bad-so when I remember, I shove a half a grapefruit or apple into my mouth. Then comes supper. Usually around 6 or so.My roomate does all the cooking. Basically healthy stuff-to non-low carbers I mean-lean meat, vegetables, salad, light dressing. Not too much butter,etc. Then comes the problems. I usually have a huge can of carnation hot chocolate and I have a few of those. At night is when I go nuts for chocolate and start screaming for chocolate cake, bars, what ever. I usually try to stick to a few cups of hot chocolate, but I've been known to eat cake every night for a month.-But that's not most of the time. I also have earl grey tea with cream and honey. And some leftover supper later. I know that's a very messed up schedule, but it is difficult with my illness, I'm better off at night (feeling wise) the entire day pretty much goes by before I even get dressed. Anyway, I thought that usually-even with the cups of hot chocolate-as long as I'm not eating the cake or whatever-I'm still taking in 1500-2000 calories a day AND vomiting most of it up every night after supper, due to reflux-this has been going on every day for over 4 years-getting pretty sick of it. I have to keep an icecream bucket in the living room, because I coudlnt' possibly run back and forth to the bathroom that often. So I really wondered through all this-how can I maintain 170 pounds? Obviously some changes need to be made. I stopped taking the amitriptyline last night. I got the Schwarzbein book out, it's 5:20 and I had my coffee-can't do without that just yet-a cup of tea with cream and a touch of honey, an apple and I'm going to have pork in tomato sauce without rice or potatoes for supper (baked),carrots, broccoli, butternut squash and there is no hot chocolate or any other kind of chocolate or sweet in the house-except tea and honey, peanut butter and toast-I'll try to stick to the tea if I start going nuts. For vitamins, E, B, Cal/Mag, C, and cranberry so I dont' pee so often. I have to take a small amount of serax or soemthing if I'm not on antidepressant that makes you sleep.As far as the antidepressant, I guess I'll try Prozac or Zoloft. All antidepressants make you gain weight, but I think amitriptyline is alot worse. If those dont' work, or I can't take them, I'm going to try amino acids and /or St. Johns Wort. I will start the book and just try to keep away from deserts (sugar)and starches until I learn more. I bought some ketone sticks yesterday-probably a bit premature, but I thought they might help inspire me. I wonder how long before I should try them? And I go for short bike rides when I can. Sorry for going on and on. I've been kind of in a state. Thanks for your replies!

[brycielan]

Wow... that sounds so familiar! I've had fibromyalgia for 11 years now so I hope I can relate. I get up and cope until about two in the afternoon before I focus on the world. Or I try to anyway. :)

Okay, now everything I'm going to say you can take with a grain of salt, because this is just my experiences.

Acidic foods, like grapefruits... they can be really harsh on a person with stomach problems. Most raw foods are. So are processed foods, and fried foods.

If you're not hungry, don't eat anything. Drink some tea (spearmint or peppermint calm a stomach down and have no caffeine)

As for coffee, whew, I wouldn't go cold turkey. I had to wean myself off diet caffeine soda... and when I have a bad headache I drink it anyway. But earl grey is a caffeine drink. And as you must have figured out from this forum caffeine is evil. LOLOL It really can play havoc on your stomach though.

As for not losing weight when you're throwing everything up. Well, that can be a variety of reasons, your medication could be one. Another is if you throw everything up your body can go into starvation mode and store everything! In other words if you don't get enough calories your body isn't going to give anything up no matter how hard you try.

Cal/Mag is great! And B, I take a multi vitamin on top of it.

In LCing calories don't count. It's the carbs that do. I'll leave you to read the book. And if you have questions you can ask or look on the Schwarzbien group thread. They're a lively bunch of people. :D

- Bry

[Myrtih]

Hi there! :wave:

:nono: Please...please, whatever you do, don't switch to Paxil!
Weight gain?? Oh my gosh, YES!
Worse than the weight gain is the withdrawal that many users go through when attempting to cut back or stop 'using'.
If in doubt, go to Google and run a search on Paxil withdrawal.

I was just reading this thread because I have FM/CFS and, as my doctor says, "chronic pain syndrome". I'm not sure what that is aside from the symptoms of the other stuff but those were his words. He also recognizes the FM/CFS, and treats the pain and spasms and problems sleeping, etc. He is also working with me as I try to exercise at Curves for Women. I have missed many days yet paid for a year membership. He is working with me to hopefully get them to extend my paid membership. I HAVE felt better on the days whrere I am able to use the machines and the 30 minute workout is over before you know it! :D

As a female Veteran with FM/CFS/CPS I was soooo thrilled to learn that the VA Clinics do recognize and treat FM/CFS/CPS symptoms. They also supply the meds. with a small co-pay as well as the medical . I am blessed!

Since an auto accident in the '60's stirred the FM up even more (I've had it since I was a youngster) I have gained at a speed that frightens me and puzzles my doctor. I have gone from 162 up to 331. Being in a hospital bed for over 10 years, to the wheelchair and walker with a seat to rest , plus the canes to walk when possible, I welcome Curves machines and can REALLY notice the difference!

Well, I got off the topic of Paxil but I felt the VA information might help others if they have ANY Military History with an Honorable discharge.

I am planning on starting God's Diet or some other similar program after the first of the month. Maybe CAD or Adkins. Any suggestions?

Gods Blessings on all of you,
Myrtih

[eurydice]

Thanks, I will keep in mind what you both have said-I'm grateful for any advice from more experienced people than myself at this stuff. It's very nice to talk to others and hear their expericences as I am feel very isolated as I'm sure some others are here.

[brycielan]

Oddly enough, God's Diet is one I've never heard of... Hmmm...

Atkins is vastly different than CAD. They're about the two opposing spectrums in LCing.

Atkins you lose fast (so I'm told, I've never been able to stay on it). CAD you get a reward meal. I like the reward meal, but I'm a snacker and you can't snack on CAD. I do a weird Schwarzbein and when I'm tired of that, I do CAD for a few days then go back.


Bry

[Myrtih]

Hello!
God's Diet is a book by Dr. Dorothy Gault-McNemee, M.D. Copyright 1999. I had to get my copy from a used book site but it was quite reasonable and it got to me very fast. I think that some book store (???) told me they could order it for me but I ordered it online and got it quicker. :)



Basically, the diet is this: If God didn't make it, don't eat it."

It is said to help FM symptoms improve. I hope so!

No Flour, Sugar, Corn Syrup and Cornstarch, etc.

The simplest diet I've ever heard of.
It is for weight-loss yet you can eat baked potato with butter and sour cream; Ham with baked sweet potato; fruit, Steak, etc.
(these are all made by God!!) Mashed potatoes;etc.

You don't binge on anything but eat in moderation.

Interesting reading for 140 pages :read:

Myrtih

[brycielan]

I'll have to go check it out! Thanks for the info.

I about do that now. Haven't quite gotten sugary things and diet soda out of my system. (I still want to read it though) I've found that most of the stuff people eat in the other WOL's include things I can't really stand. They're big on pork rinds in Atkins... gack.

CAD comes to a point that really made sense to me though and helped me a lot. Carbs are addictive. Very addictive. But I ate the reward meal and man, I wanted more. I think that's why I have to do CAD only when I'm struggling then go back to a stricter LC.

So I could see doing God's Diet but limiting the intake of carbs. And truth be told, my pain and my sleep have been better since LCing. As long as I don't stress out. :daze: then it's a struggle.

Bry

[eurydice]

Hey, I was just wondering, I know it kinda goes against the point but I buy those chocolate bars made in Germany that are made for diabetics. They are called Frankonia milk chocolate and come in 100 g. They only have fructose in them as far as sugar goes. The ingredients are: Fructose,whole milk powder, cocoa butter, unsweetened chocolate, soy lecithin, vanillin (artificial flavour) May contain traces of peanut and/or other nuts.
Now the reason I ask is, since it only contains fructose, could this be used as a treat without messing things up too badly? Is fructose a "good" sugar compared to dextrose, etc., or is it just as bad? **Awaits answer with hope in her heart** ;)

I would be better with a program that you dont' have to follow an exact menu. I'd be better just knowing what I can and can't eat, I think. My main problem is chocolate. (As you can tell) :daze:

[brycielan]

Fructose is a fruit sugar. It's still a sugar but (I'm assuming here) it's not treated with the chemical processes of regular sugar.

When it comes to raising your blood sugar or for diabetes, it still elevates it. (it's weird that's for diabetics)

Look on the package for the carbohydrates. If you're doing Schwarzbien you can have so much at a meal (or a snack). EAT A PROTEIN WITH IT THOUGH! Like cheese, or a bit of whatever meat you have for a leftover.

That's a big thing that will help you blood sugar not spike.

If I were you though, I would mix the chocolate bar with something else. Add some fruit, while that still has fruit sugar in it, it's natural with some fiber in it. Like strawberries. Or add some heavy whipping cream. That will be a staple in LCing. Or nuts, walnuts cancel out since the carbohydrates and fiber are the same.

If you really want chocolate try to find some with artificial sweetners in it. Or make a treat that uses unsweetened chocolate with a sweetner. I don't advocate them, but it's sorta unavoidable if you're LCing and want something sweet.

Did that help? :)

Bry

[Myrtih]

Hi, again!

Bry, you have written just about the very thing I planned to do. I have had great success with the CALP and only mess up by eating unwise in the 'reward meal'. Then............all bets are off!! :mad:

I thought Adkins but that is not something that I could 'live' with for the rest of my life. I could live with CAD and I'm sure that I could with God's Diet once I kicked the diet soda.
I lose weight slower but hey!! Ya can't have everything!! Can ya?? If we can, please clue me in!

I like a balance bar BUT, I soon start treating them like a treat or a candy bar so I've decided that they are 'out' Rats!! :mad:

Hope you can find a book seller that has the book. I didn't have any problem finding a used book and it is just like new.

Good Luck
Myrtih

[eurydice]

Oh yeah, here it is, Carbohydrates- 24 g. That's for half the bar, so if I eat the whloe bar, it's 48 g.Yes, your post gave me some ideas. So I should make something with equal (sugar substitute) or something in it. I will buy some to put in my coffee as well. So it's important to eat a protien with it? I will remember that. I screwed up today already. My rommate bought a horrible carrot cake home and I had a tiny sliver-good thing it was disgusting! Then had a bowl of honey shreddies with skim milk. And tea with honey. I'll start over tomorrow. Thanks for the tips, I obviously have a lot to learn and better get reading.
The rest on that bar is (half the bar)
energy- 283 calories
protein-5 g
fat-19 g
sugars- 24g
of which fructose-17 g
of which lactose-6 g.
I dont' know why it says lactose all of a sudden, anyway, it's says its supposed to be for diabetes-Canadian Diabetes Association Food Choice. weird heh?
What does CALP and CAD stand for? SO I can look up the book?

[brycielan]

Don't I wish we could have everything! It always seems like everything I stick in my mouth is against me!

The only thing I would worry about with the God's Diet is overeating the carbs. I could eat a whole loaf of homemade bread if given the chance. In for a penny in for a pound... literally. :D

I will look for the book, but I won't sweat over it.

Eurydice - (I love greek myth BTW)

Always eat a protein with whatever you decide to have. Eat it first, so your body will have to work on that before the carbs. Read the carbs on whatever you eat (cereal and milk are very high) it will shock you and change your habits of what you eat.

When it comes to sweetners, aspartame (Equal) gives a lot of people problems. I don't like the taste of Splenda. So I'm left with Saccharin (sweet n' low). I figure they're all going to kill you in one way or the other, so pick your poison and enjoy it. LOLOL

One thing to note though, aspartame loses it's sweetness when put in something hot. I pick sweet n' low for stuff like that.

Don't worry about screwing up :) I do it all the time. But I learn from them and move on and try to do better the next day. Don't discourage yourself before you get anywhere.

And it's good to ask questions. There are a lot of people here, including me, that are willing to help.

If you want I can tell you what I eat and what I buy at the store. That helps sometimes to get an idea of what's what.

Bry

[eurydice]

Thanks alot Brycielan. I'll look at the Atkins Book and the Schwarzbien book and then I'll be better able to know what I'm talking about. I looked at the Atkins before and he says you have to have this big meaty breakfast. I couldnt' do that, but I like the idea of checking to see if you are in ketosis, then you know if you're getting somewhere. I'll read a bit and come back. Thanks again.

[colinjn]

Hi There all,
I've got to jump in here and add my two cents.

First I think you are eating way too much sugar! If you have a sweet tooth, look at getting some "Splenda" (sucralose) to add to your meals and drinks.

For the cravings, Dr. Atkins recommends Glutamine, in a fairly large dose. Check out the book.

For seratonin levels, look at getting some 5-HTP.

Lastly, here is the perennial advice for success. Choose a published plan and stick with it. Do not add your own little "improvements" until a good three months or more have gone bye. You have to break old habits and not reinforce them by cheating. You have to accept this as a "way of life" and not a "temporary fix". I'm being blunt here, but experience with successful people and the ones with continuous struggles has proven that this is the best way.

On a personal note. I have chosen Atkins because I looked at what foods I enjoyed eating the most (within the low carbing lists) and decided that Atkins fit the bill. Yes he is higher fat than others, but fat gives flavour and satiety. Protein is a bit tricky for someone with CFS because too much can cause an insulin spike. And being in enforced rest, means that I cannot burn off the excess protein and carbs. So if you are in the same boat as me you might want to give it a try. Remember ATKINS IS NOT ONLY INDUCTION. Sorry for the shout but people seem to only read the induction part of the book and think that that is all there is. It drives me a bit bonkers! It is really a behavior modification program. Of course if you secretly DON'T want your behavior modified, that is another issue.......

I know this is a bit strong but it is meant in the most helpful way.

Thanks
Colin

PS euridice, your symptoms sound like there might be a GI issue. Has your Internist givin you the ole barium milkshake? Also you might want to look for a naturopath to check the supplements you are taking. Good Luck.

[Myrtih]

:eek: Thanks Colin, I needed that!!!! :D

Myrtih

[eurydice]

Thanks Colin for your reply. I've mentioned the barium thing to my doctor. First he wants to send me to another endocrinologist. He wants to deal with my borderline hypothyroidism and can't figure out why such a low dose of thyroid hormone affected my breathing. We don't have that armour thryoid stuff here in Canada. As far as the antidepressant I was talking about I was at the doc today and I picked Prozac to try. I know people gain weight on it too, but I've read here that people on prozac were able to lose the weight and I had to pick something. Thanks for the tips about the Splenda, Glutamine and 5-HTP. I doubt I can take the 5_HTP while on Prozac, but if the prozac doesnt' work out, that's what I will try, I've looked into amino acids for that as well. I've gotten the Atkins book and the Schwarzbein book and will read them. I have a terrible chocolate craving problem, even as I sit here right now I am eating one of my fructose chocolate bars, but like you said Colin, I'm going to look into the different programs,pick one and stick with it. I'm sick of being fat and tired. I'm considering seeing a naturopath, but they've got to sell you expensive herbal treatments and that's out of my budget at the moment. Sorry, I'm blathering,. Thanks again all!.
Hey Colin, I just looked at your profile, man you've done excellent!

[colinjn]

Hi Eurydice
Glad to see that you are active in trying to figure out what is happening to you. A couple of tips on chocolate. Check out Ross chocolate bars. You can usually find them in the diabetic section of some Shoppers Drug Marts and in the Alive vitamin stores. They have the best quality of sugar free bars. Purdy's also sells their sugar free truffels. I quite like them.

Be aware that the sugar alcohol sweeteners in these bars do tend to create weight loss stalls in some people. I guess I'm one of the lucky ones, but if you stall you might want to check them out as the culprit.

Also, it has been noted in several conversations I've had, that the body has sort of a pavlovian response to sweetness in the beginning, and will tend to secrete insulin even with artificial sweeteners. That old mind-body connection tripping us up again!

Good Luck in your quest

Colin

[eurydice]

There's really "legal" chocolate bars I could eat?! Hallelujah! I'll look for them thanks.

[eurydice]

Hi, I would like to ask Colin a couple questions about 5-HTP. I've tried to PM him and Liberty. It keeps coming up saying I dont' have permission. I am logged in. What am I doing wrong?

[DuPont]

You have to have at least 25 posts to send a private message. I maybe able to help with the 5-htp, I have some experience taking it. (500mg/day for 2 years)

[eurydice]

Hey thanks a lot DuPont, I wondered what was going on! Yes, Colin mentioned the 5-HTP and I was just looking it up. It looks great. I have just started Prozac, but it seems that people gain weight on it and it makes you feel weird etc. I just wanted to ask if it was available in Canada at the stores and which store. (colin lives in the same city as me, so I guess it must be-unless he orders it. ) But also, I wanted to talk to someone who was taking it-what do you feel like on it? Does it help depression and weight loss? And what about side effects? How long until you felt it working? Thanks for any information you could share. Oh also, are there any withdrawal symptoms if you stop taking it? Thank you.

[DuPont]

I don't know about buying 5htp in Canada, but I do know that you can buy it at iherb.com and they ship internationally.

I was suffering from moderate to severe depression when I started taking 5htp. I started with 250mg and I felt better with in an hour. I did notice that it wore off by the afternoon, so I took another 250mg dose. I did that for approximately 2 years, while also in therapy amongst other things that I did to relieve the depression. The book that I got my info from recommends a dose of 300mg for mild to moderate depression, also, you may not feel the effects for up to six weeks.

How did it feel? Like the black cloud was lifted, I could raise my head and see rays of sunshine, which made me happy. The pressure on my back and neck melted away. It was a miracle. I finally felt like life wasn't hopeless and overwhelming, I knew could finally deal with my problems.

The only side effects I have had were, stomach upset until I switched to Nature's Way Brand that is enteric coated and doesn't get broken down until it reaches the small intestine, and fatigue. Taking the morning dose with a cup of coffee helped to keep me awake during the day. The fatigue wore off with time. Some people experience increased anxiety in the beginning until their bodies become accustomed to the 5htp.

I didn't lose any weight but I didn't gain any either.

Here is a great website for info on 5htp
http://www.smart-publications.com/books/5htp/toc.html

And if you want to talk on a forum check out:
http://www.sjwinfo.org/forums/forums.shtml

[eurydice]

Thanks for your help DuPont, I really appreciate it.

[liberty]

Hi eurydice,

how r u doin?

I read u tried to pm me....is there anything i can help u with ?

I didn't know that we needed 25 posts to pm........thats probably why i cant pm too!



Liberty x

[eurydice]

Hi Liberty, I was just going to ask you about that armour thyroid. I've since looked it up though and it's not available here in Canada. My doctor hadn't even heard of it. My TSH keeps fluctuating, going slightly high, but the l-thyroxine they keep giving me doesn't seem to agree with me. The last time I took it, just 50 mcgs, it affected my breathing, but it's weird because I'd never had a breathing problem before and when I stopped the drug, the problem went away. I tried the pills again -same thing, but then the breathing problems have come back on their own, so now I'm on my third 20 pill prescription of xanax. (yeah :thdown: ) Anyway, I'm being sent to a Dr. Wilkins- a specialist -endocrinologist. My doctor doesn't know why the pills are bothering me and with thyroid disease-I think it just gets worse over time, so If I can't take the one pill we have for it here in Canada. I dont' know what I'm supposed to do. anyway, sorry, didnt' mean to go on so. I was going to pm you, cause this is supposed to be a low carb support board-not a diagnose eurydice board. I went and bought a couple of those Ross chocolate bars Colin mentioned-they're great! But pricey. I sent my roomate to get sugar substitute and he came back with Sugar Twin and I dont' think that's right-it says dextrose. I started the book. I took my first 50 g of 5-THP just a little while ago, cause I decided I wanted to try that before the Prozac. So thanks for the tips everyone. Last night I sent my roomate for a little treat and he comes back with 2 huge trays of chocloate cake-(They were on sale ;) ) So I don't think I'll send him anymore! I've gotten rid of them. (the Cakes) I'm finding it a little difficult to try a new eating program with all these weird physical things going on, but for now will attempt to cut down and off the sugar, and caffeine no or very little bread, rice, etc. Thansk again. You're all very nice here.

[colinjn]

Hi eurydice,
I was away for a while and am just catching up on things. You were asking about sources in Vancouver? I use YVS and Genesis Nutrition. Genesis is a good place to get things cheap. The other stores are not too happy about their pricing and threaten to boycott brands that give them special deals, but it's good for the consumer!

I think you have all the other info you were after from everyone else. Good luck in your search.

Colin

[liberty]

Hi eurydice,

sorry i've taken so long to reply ...... i've been expereiencing a flare up of my me syptoms hence have to rest more............ :( !


In regards to ARMOUR THYROID my consultant gets it direct from the US.....as it is not available in England. It is made by FOREST PHARMACEUTICALS, INC. aSUBSIDARY OF FOREST LABORITIES, INC, ST LOUIS, MO 63045.
iN RELATION TO YOUR BREATHING PROBLEMS .....I HAD THAT TOO.
It may be due to the dose being too high initially .....perhaps a lower dose to start off with might be recommended.......just a thought....see if your doc can lower it or take half a tablet instead.


Good luck

liberty x :wave:

[eurydice]

Thanks alot Liberty for the address for the armour thyroid. I'll write it down and show it to my doctor. Yes, the dose of the l-thyroxine was 50mcgs, I could break them in half. The weird thing however, is that I haven't taken those drugs for weeks and I still can't breathe. I've been waiting to be able to breathe before starting them again. I am now on no medication that I wasn't on before I ever had a breathing problem. While the doctors are obviously convinced it's anxiety and have therefore prescribed xanax, I dont' have any other symptoms(regarding panic attacks). No heart racing, it doesn't just come and go quickly, it's starts in the morning, goes all day, I go to bed, and so on every day for a few weeks now. First it would last a few days then go away and I would not take the xanax. This time, it has been going on every day for a couple of weeks. I DO NOT want to get addicted to xanax. But I don't seem to have a choice at this point. I thought anxiety attacks were short lived-a few times a week-not constant not being able to get enough air. They've x-rayed my lungs and listened to my chest and I'm "perfectly healthy". Anyway, and this on top of all the other regular pain, fatigue, symtoms. My diets gone to hell, I think I've even gained weight. I've been so exhausted that I can't even read the book. Anyway, it's been really bad lately. I've upped my dose of 5-HTP to 100 mgs today. I'm really happy with the tips I've got here. As the doctors have done nothing for me, except make me worse. Oh well. Thanks too for your supply tip, Colin. I'm right by metrotown, so there's lots of stores close by. thanks liberty.

[missyvonne]

i do all this too! i have bi-polar disorder, and i am presently on effexor, which i have had the best results with, plus NO weight gain. i have tried about five or six others. the thing is, if one thing doesnt work for me i wouldnt tell you not to use it, because with our different metabolisms we all react differently to different meds plus different dosages. effexor and ...oh dear, im fogging over...it starts with a c:) they are the cleanest ones of the lot, having the least amount of interaction problems. do you have really bad cravings or just normal sized ones? :) i still go"oh, id sure like a (fill in the blank), but i dont go crazy and feel like if i dont have it ill die:) there are so many good sweets for low carbers now! i love the truffles by...oh of course i cant think of that either:)...and a new company called...judys? makes peanut brittle and english toffee that is JUST like the real stuff(and im really picky!) i think just keep communicating with your dr about what works and doesnt work-it is all very individual... effexor and that *C* one:) have the fastest uptake too, so you dont have to wait weeks for it to kick in. i know that the fish oils and salmon especially are super good for mental illness, and depression. i wish you well!
deb

[eurydice]

Hey thanks. I guess you're referring to celexa. About the cravings-they're for chocolate and they are really bad. Take care and best wishes.

[quietone]

Where to start!?

First of all, it sounds as though you have fibro.


All my tests come up "normal". I'm exhausted, muscle pain, brain fog, can't work, can't sleep, reflux everyday(bring up food), weakness, bad skin, hair loss, dry eyes, problem going to the bathroom etc. I've seen an endocrinologist-everything's "normal" hormone wise-except a low cortisol, but when they stimulated it-it was "normal"-case closed. I'm at least 40 pounds overweight.Anyway, What antidepressant would you recommend for least weight gain and what the heck do you do about really bad cravings for sweets. I've got will power-I've quit smoking, drinking, and a lot of other things-this use to be far less of a problem-but like I said-I couldn't even stick to Scarsdale for one day! I think I have CFS, noise bothers me, smells bother me-heck-everything bothers me!

Fibro flare-up seem to go along with Seasonal Affective Disorder. And you have all the classic symptoms. The only thing you didn't mention was tender points. There is a fibro board here. Check it out. This is a good website: http://www.fmnetnews.com/

Now...antidepressants. I have tried Zoloft, Prozac, Celexa, Wellbutrin and Effexor. Effexor wins hands down! It doesn't just help with the serotonin the way others do, and it doesn't just help with dopamine the way Welbutrin does. It helps with both. And it also helps with the peculiar pains I have. And it also helps with my eye problems. And my stomach. It does not help with the skin and hair problems. And it helps with my memory problems that come along at this time. And my "hating life" attitude.

All antidepressants cause side-effects...even the Effexor. But with it I have only dry mouth, nausea at first and sleep issues. But I found if I take it with my coffee as soon as I get up, I am better able to get to sleep. But when I can't, I just take a benedryl pill. It is really strange because if you sit down, you will fall asleep and never get up. But if you keep going, it helps you keep going. I am more disciplined when I am on it.

Regarding low carb. I can't take it all the way down like with Atkins. I have to have a modified level.

Oh, and Prozac has a long half-life. Effexor does not. So you will feel it "wearing off." It's not really wearing off because the half-life is 38 hours, but it does lose its strengh and you have to be careful because you will eat if you are not aware. That is why people can gain weight. and also, why you eat to start with. If you eat because of stress, then you will probably lose weight. But just be aware that you can have tremendous cravings in the evening and be prepared to ignore them after you have eaten a reasonable dinner.

Hope all this helps. Be glad to answer any specific questions.

[missyvonne]

plus, the effexor(for me)has the least amount of interference with my libido. yes youre right about effexor having both the seratonin and dopamine effects in our favor! this has worked better than any other one for me, plus i can still lose weight on this woe. when they have done tests for you and you come up "normal", this is no doubt what you have. testing for cfids or fms is basically a process of elimination. you have all the symptoms i have had. i dont know very much about SAD. can someone tell me about it?
about chocolate..ross is good! also carbolite makes good choccy, and Pure Delite is my very favorite in choccy-its belgian and they make truffles too. i found a place that sells that judy's stuff, no kidding, and ive eaten loads of brands, this stuff is to die for. here is the website: http://www.lowcarboutfitters.com/chocolatecandy.html
if you cant find much around where you live. i know here in eugene its really hard to find stuff, but our next city over, portland has a low carb store! good luck on finding a good antidepressant for you-finding low carb treats is easy:) and i have to say, this website is so so organized i cant even believe it-and everyone is so nice:)
deb j.

[quietone]

libido. I forgot about that. Effexor has the least effect for me also.

And I tried Paxil. I forgot that one. And I also tried one that I don't remember the name of, a few years ago that I took to help with the sleeping problems. It helped me sleep but made me a total witch the next day.

[missyvonne]

paxil is one of the six ive been on too. the sleep disorder goes along with cfids/fms. ive had to take trazadone to sleep. i used to be on something else...ive tried more magnesium, it worked the first couple of days, then my body got used to it . being on anti depressants, i cant take melatonin. so its a hard one to get around. if i do some excersizing before bed, then a warm bath, it helps. (i do tai chi).
how does anyone feel about medical marijuana for the pain of cfids/fms and help in sleeping? it is legal here. i have tried it a few times for that and it has really helped me. im thinking about asking for a subscription, for the occasional time where even the trazadone doesnt work, and the pain is great. i have taken naprosyn prn for pain, it takes a <i>little</i> of the edge off, then was using darvocet after i had knee surgery. that stuff makes me in more pain than originally after about four days. i was just put on a new pain med, dont know the name-but its not really doing anything. what are some things some of you have tried?
i am very glad to be here! i just cant get over how its laid out. someone took very great care in making it:)
hugs,
deb

[quietone]

did you ever get any answers regarding your symptoms?

[quietone]

did you see the information on SAD?

Can I help answer any questions about it?

I see you have Fibro/CFS. I have yet to see anyone with either that didn't have SAD, even if they didn't get diagnosed with it. Seems to run hand-in-hand.

[eurydice]

Thanks for piping in quietone and missyvonne-you're right, this is a great place and the people here are very nice and helpful. As far as the medical marijuana, it's legal here too. I don't see any reason why a person shouldn't use it if it helps them to sleep and with pain, but I would be a little concerned about "the munchies". I've finally got a good start on my eating program. I can't follow an exact menu because my roomate does the cooking and shopping because I'm too wiped out to do it, but he knows what I'm trying to do, so he's supportive and I just don't eat the rice, potatoes. I just have meat and veggies. I actually gained a bit more weight-that's what got my butt in gear. Then when I started I lost 2 pounds. So I'm taking it day by day. Anyway, yes, I got checked for the pressure points and I had a bunch of them. One of them on my back by my "wing" bone hurts like mad without even touching it. I'm off all antidepressants right now. I'm trying St. John's Wort. I have heard of effexor and lots of people-even my doctor said it's a good one. But, I've heard a few people say it's really hard to get off of and that kind of frightens me. Which is stupid I know, because if it helps, it could make a real difference. And everyone reacts differently of course. I'm going for therapy soon, I've read that regular talk therapy can be as effective as antidepressants , but that doesn't take in the immediate physical benefits that some antidepressants can have. It funny you mention SAD. I actually like fall and winter better than spring and summer. I can't stand the heat and the brightness. Plus, I hate being fat in the summer. In the winter, under a bunch of sweaters, it's alot more comforting to me than to walk around sweating in a long shirt and pants because I won't wear shorts. Yes, the cravings in the evening-that's when it hits me! I can go all day up until 7 or 8 then WHAM! That's when I mess up my day. But I've gotten some chromium and I'm doing better. I'll admit I've had a couple small slips, but I've definitely cut way down on the amount. So I'm going to keep at it. I definfintely notice when I eat properly, I dont' have reflux, or not as much and I can go to the bathroom easier. So it really does make a difference. Thanks again.

[Sillychili]

:thup: I need to give a thumbs up for Effexor also! I have been on all sorts of things over the last 15 years. Last summer I saw a new Psychiatrist who is the best I have ever met. He is incredible! He also strongly suggested an omega 3 supplement which I have been taking in the form of Flax oil caps. My FM is under control...I no longer sleep all the time or feel like I will collapse...I had many of the same symptoms you have. I also saw an endocrinologist who, although my tests were (all but thyroid) "normal", scratched below the surface and ordered a glucose uptake test which is done by drawing blood over 4 hours after a fasting and then drinking glucose. He discovered I was "insulin resistent" which not only makes you feel crappy but makes you crave as well as keeps your body from losing weight. I feel awsome..I workout 5 times a week and before this I slept sometimes 20 hours a day and was in so much pain I could hardly lift my arms to brush my hair! Good luck and hang in there! :roll:

[quietone]

I am trying this naturally. (Eating)

Not really sure if there is a difference or not yet.

Became allergic to Effexor and have now had to go off of it.

I am trying the new drug Lex????, but I don't like it. For one thing, it makes me forgetful...ha, ha, ha

[summer*rai]

Hi I also have fibromyalgia and lupus. I take 75 mg of amytriptline, 25 mg paxil, and zanax as needed....I am also diabetic...I cannot get off my medications, as these are needed along with many others...I am also diabetic...

I have been on the atkins for 2 weeks and 4 days and have lost 13 lbs. I am a sugar aholic...Binge sweet eater, reformed bulimic...I gained lots of weight when I gave up that and also gained with 10 years on and off of predisone. After the first week on atkins, My desire for sweets and the need to binge has stopped. My sugar would swing from around 45 to 285 through out the day. At 45, I was grabbing sugar and anything I could get down to stop the dizzyness...Now I'm at a steady state with my sugar maintaining around 100....So, really be serious about counting your carbs and I think that you possible can loose....I know that I am. I could not stay on a calorie counting diet...Well, it's late will see you later. Good luck

[eurydice]

Hey thanks for the post summer *rai. That's really something that you are losing weight and still be able to take your needed meds. Especially since some of them have a reputation for weight gain, so it just shows that for some people if you really stick to your low carb that you can do it. Congrats on the loss that's great! I hope you find that low carbing helps you feel better too as so many here have stated that it helped them. The symptoms of autoimmune diseases can really be bad sometimes. And you a diabetic as well, that's a lot for you to deal with. Best wishes and thanks again!

[summer*rai]

Just hoping that you have a good day...I got on the scales this morning a Wednesday...no gain, no loss...I figured in my 3rd week would stall...I have a rheumatologis appointment tomarrow...His scales will actually show no loss because I had gained up to 210 from 197 since I last saw him. ..I'm having the constipation problem...any advise...with all the meds, darvocets, etc...?? How do you start a journal...I can't seem to find the right place????cya

[eurydice]

A good day to you as well! Don't worry about your stall, the same thing happened to me-I gained and then lost to what I was to begin with, but you'll lose more. Other posters will probably be able to help with these issues better than me. As far as the constipation, I have it too. Really bad. For 5 years. I have to use enemas or rubber gloves and vaseline (Sorry for being graffic) I think I've tried all conventional treatments. Metimucil, eating raw bran, lactulose, stool softeners, laxatives, mineral oil-mineral was yucky! And did not help me at all-it just made a mess. I'm sure there are others here who would know more about other approaches and I would be interested to hear from them on this as well. Do you drink plenty of water? As far as a journal, I'm not sure, I've never looked for one. I do that the old fashioned way. Sorry I couldn't be more help. Take care and good luck at your appointment. Oh I just went and looked about that journal for you. At the beginning of all the forums, If you just go to the top of this page and click on the red Active LC forum icon, it takes you to all the forums. One of the forums is called My Low Carb Journal where you can tell people how you're doing and keep track of your progress. Is that what you were looking for?

[summer*rai]

I bought flax oil today...we'll see how that works...I have an appointment with my rheumy tomarrow. Actually I am beginning to feel alot better....My sugar is still normal...eury...how is your fibro doing?...I've only had a couple of bad days this month..I actually walked today and did stretching exercises. This way I can tell doctor tomarrow...yes, yes, I have started doing the exercises that you wanted me to...LOL Just gotta keep on doing it. He had upped my amytriptline to 75 mg the last time that I went in, and added the paxil...The amytriptline does help with the pain. I am having trouble with my left hip...I'm hoping that I can strengthen the muscles there by stretching...I feel the best that I've felt for a long time. I had a serious bout with lupus/fibro two years ago, and am finally coming out of it and feeling normal...My doctor warns me that it will happen again...I can always hope that it won't. ...I hope that you are feeling good...A cold front is coming in tonight. I live in south texas and the fronts make me ache. I love the warm south winds that come in once the northerner passes...well thanks again....

[eurydice]

Wow Texas-you're a long way from me. I'd love to go to Texas one day. It is a totally different type of weather and type of climate than way up here in the rainforest of the north! Thanks for asking. I was feeling pretty rough for a while. I had to deal with the government over some disability issues and that was very stressful, I'm just starting some new thyroid meds so that's what I'm concentrating on now. Having to get used to them and I take xanax to sleep, but it makes me feel horrible when I get up, but if these thyroid pills help, then that should be the beginning of straightening out some of my ills. Yes, flax oil is supposed to be really good for all kinds of things. I have to start stretching. I have degenerative disc problem so my back slides in and out all the time. I should go and see what I can do exercise wise and what I can't with that happening. On a good day, I have a bike and I ride around this nice big park right by where I live, sometimes I put my music on my walkman and walk around and look at the trees and the squirrels. Yes, I found that the amitriptyline helped me with feeling better too, actually, maybe I should go back on it. I was afraid because of the weight question, but you seem to be beating it, so there you go. I'm glad you're feeling better. Take care summer*rai.

[summer*rai]

Hi eury...and everyone.....Went to the doctor yesterday...and actually had a good report...right now after 10 years, my lupus test are showing negative and right now after 3 weeks on this atkins diet the fibromyalgia is " behaving".....My rheumy was very happy that I had started the atkins diet...I told him that I was concerned about taking the amytriptline 75 mg, synthroid .088, paxil .25...and zanax (like you to sleep)...plus all my other medicines to long to list...He said amytriptline is only a " little " pill...it cannot make me gain weight, however, it can my my appetite increase...He said "when your hungry do like the books said...eat the protien"...and also with the paxil, and zanax...He thought that the atkins was a good program for me to be on with the fibro...I'm also taking alot of supplements, which I have never been good to take...I am feeling so much better...I told him that I was afraid that I might do something crazy like try to go back to work, or finish my nursing school....and He said NOOOOOOO.....you can't do that...just enjoy feeling better and not try to put myself in stress like the way I have done in the past...He said that he saw so many people swing High when they feelg good, do too much, then fall flat on their faces...My persoanality is a type "A" with a "F" body...Sheesh...It's cold here in Texas today...however, we took a ride down the coast...we live about 11 miles from the gulf...as soon as the south winds come back, we'll be back in the 70's...well hope everyone has a good weekend.....

[summer*rai]

Hi...Since I have been on the Atkins for the last 3 weeks on have not cheated at all...the sugar obsession is not longer with me...I can't understand how that "It" just went away after the first week of being on the Atkins diet....I have been on the diet 3 weeks, starting my fourth week tomarrow....My sugar was ranging from 45-285....really swinging......and though I can't believe it, I have lost 15 lbs and people are starting to notice...I haven't felt this good in years...I'm even have been able to quit taking my diabetes meds....Two years ago I spent 4 months in bed and because of being so "out of it".... with fibro/lupus ...I couldn't even drive a car...now 2 years later...I am beginning to feel good...Now you have to understand that "good" for me is still living with pain and the effects of fibro...but it's managable right now...I have to keep myself out of stress...and I take lots of meds...Perhaps the Atkins will help you too..I understand what everyone on this board is going through...I've been diagnosed for 10 years....I also have hashimoto's...a thyroid disease...Eurydice...have you ever been diagnosed with hashimoto's.????...

[eurydice]

That's really great news that you're feeling well summer*rai! You must do as your doctor says and don't over do things now that you are feeling better, wow, and 15 pounds that's wonderful! I dont' know what the heck is happening with me. I feel like I have malaria or soemthing. I am just assuming what it feels like to have malaria and am certainly not making light of it if anyone here has had it. What I mean is, I just feel so weak and freezing and sweating and my mind feels the same, I walk around my apartment in my night shirt with my robe on and a blanket wrapped around all day and I sit in a wretched daze. All I know is that my TSH is high. My doctor's dont' know exactly what I've got. I have the symptoms and pain and tender points of fibro and chronic fatigue syndrome, I throw up my food very night over and over, but dont' feel nausea-it's more like regurgitation, like reflux, but most every day, almost every time I eat-no matter what I eat. Even liquid. I've pretty much had it. What dosage of xanax do you take for bed, if you dont' mind me asking summer*rai? I take 1.5 mg usually. Sometimes, if I feel like I can't breathe in the day, I take a half a pill, .5 mg. When I wake up in the morning I feel so sick and hungover-I know all about these pills, so I dont' need to be told about them, but I have to sleep somehow. Do you feel rough in the morning summer *rai? Take care.

[summer*rai]

erydice...I only take .5 to 1.5......I am trying to get off them...I am trying to ween off of them and use just when I'm really stressed...I have some Ambien which is a sleeping pilll that I have had and have been taking them this week. When I go to bed my mind won't shut down...I am an artist and so I paint in my brain at the same time I'm counting sheep...moving my foot with the beat of a song that is in my head...I have too much imput ...Just wish I could turn the "motion pictures" in my head...so it's hard to relax and go to sleep....(Gosh that sounds psyco doesn't it?
Eury you might want to have the doctor test for the antibodies that causes hashimoto's...(a thyroid problem)...The disease can make you feel terrible....I know they found it with a test for antibodies..Back in the 80's before I was diagnosed with lupus in 1991..I found out that I have allergies to most everything and my allergist diagnosed me with cf because I felt sooo bad...Lupus is all in my family...grandpa, aunts, mom...cousins...etc plus other forms of autoimmune diseases...so when I got very, very ill around 1991-92....a great doctor in houston diagnosed me...over the years I would have several years like you that I couldn't do anything...now my new rheumatologist is testing me and my lupus test are normal...but still have the fibro....I really hope it's true...cause people with lupus in my family die young. I'm 50..I remember one time when I was really bad....and had mostly 30 days of the month down in bed...I looked at the sadness in my husbands eye and made myself get up and do as much as I could that day..He was so afraid that I was not going to make it. I made myself get up....gradually over a year...each month I would have more good days...then it came when I was having more good days than bad....and finally I'm down now to maybe 3-5 bad days where I have to stay in bed....I worked with the doctors to get me on the right mix of medicines...I was allergic to viox ...had a severe reaction when mixing it with other meds and predisone...I'm finding that the antidepressants help alot with my paint..I know I got depressed....If you can...get up , shower, put on make-up and pretend if necessary that you are well...We all have to fight the nasty depression that comes with fibro...I am finding that we can learn to live...I may try that calcium that' y'll have been talking about...I'm also gonna try to find some herbal tea that might help me to sleep...Doest anyone know of a tea that will help???.....:)..... :)

[summer*rai]

eury...no the zanax does not make me drowsy in the morning...I guess because I have been on all these drugs for years...How much of the amytriptline are you taking...I started with 25 then they raised it to 50 the next year, and now I am on 75 mg of amytriptline...

Has the doctor tested you for lupus?...I am assuming that you have had that done...I took Plaquinel for years which is actually a drug for malaria...It was for the lupus..I had sever stomach and gastric problems...my liver enzyme ggt was about 3x normal...seizures, malara rash, false positive on a syphlis test, and a positive ana... (cant spell)

Find you a good rheumy....

gotta get...7 year old grandaughter has a basketball game...

:wave:

[eurydice]

Thanks alot for your kind replies summer*rai. I'm sorry I sounded so negative yesterday, it was a bad day. You've had lots of bad days too and now you're feeling better, I really think that's great. It's nice to speak with someone who knows what it can be like though. I was on 10 mg amitriptyline, then I went off it. I went off it because I gained a few pounds and panicked. But that could've been due to something else too, I don't know. I'm only on the xanax for now. I should go back on the amitriptyline, as I do feel a bit better physically and mentally on it. I have been tested for lupus, that was negative. I'm not sure if I've been tested for thyroid antibodies, I looked at my records and I think I was tested for it but was negative. My TSH is high, that's really all they ever found. And my am cortisol was low, but they stimulated it and said it was ok. I've never had my T3 done but my free T4 was normal. My doctor did say he would refer me to a specialist here who's got a great reputation among patients. He's the head of Endocrinology at Vancouver General, so hopefully he may be able to help. I've never seen a rheumy yet. I was wondering about Ambien, I've never tried it. That's cool that you're an artist, I can't say I'm an artist, but I would like to take art classes one day and I like to sing and write and take pictures. I love going to the websites that show all the masters paintings, all the Renaisannce artists and Van Gogh. I love William Bouguereau too. I go to this website http://www.artrenewal.org/ and look at all the paintings. I love color. Thanks for your support summer*rai. I said to my roomate "I was talking to a nice woman from Texas today!" :wave: HaHa I've edited this 5 times already, my brain! Anyway, about the tea, camomile of course, there's a Sleepytime Tea by Celestial Seasonings.

[summer*rai]

Hey...I'm not that great ...but I love to paint....If you have a desire, you can learn to paint. I was not born with an enate talent...just a desire....Thanks for the great website...Nice...I hope you find out what is wrong....Ambien helps me sleep without drug hangovers in the morning...If you have fibro...the amytriptline is suppose to be the one drug that rheumatologist like to use...it is suppose to be the most effective....i KNOW. something has really helped....Did you have a productive day today?...I hope so...Today the diet was hard..I'm just not hungry...I had bought some cheddar cheese and some salami...it wasn't bad I'm sure, but the smell and the taste....well.....hubby and I just couldn't stand it...I threw it away....My smell and taste buds are changing...I ate egg omlet for breakfast...threw away my lunch...and ate pork rinds with good shredded cheddar that I melted in the micro for about 30 seconds. It was great...for dinner we had steak on the grill and salad with olive oil and vinegar. I've got to start cooking something other than just meat and salads...Hubby and I are just really not hungry, nor do we crave. I made myself eat tonight. I'm taking all the recomended vitamins...well gotta run cya

[summer*rai]

Hey...I'm not that great ...but I love to paint....If you have a desire, you can learn to paint. I was not born with an enate talent...just a desire....Thanks for the great website...Nice...I hope you find out what is wrong....Ambien helps me sleep without drug hangovers in the morning...If you have fibro...the amytriptline is suppose to be the one drug that rheumatologist like to use...it is suppose to be the most effective....i KNOW. something has really helped....Did you have a productive day today?...I hope so...Today the diet was hard..I'm just not hungry...I had bought some cheddar cheese and some salami...it wasn't bad I'm sure, but the smell and the taste....well.....hubby and I just couldn't stand it...I threw it away....My smell and taste buds are changing...I ate egg omlet for breakfast...threw away my lunch...and ate pork rinds with good shredded cheddar that I melted in the micro for about 30 seconds. It was great...for dinner we had steak on the grill and salad with olive oil and vinegar. I've got to start cooking something other than just meat and salads...Hubby and I are just really not hungry, nor do we crave. I made myself eat tonight. I'm taking all the recomended vitamins...well gotta run cya

[summer*rai]

So funny you mentioned Bouguereau....I am taking a portrait class and we are trying to draw, then paint Bouguereau's "The Story" painting...LOL....I would love to do portraits. His portraits and paintings are wonderful....I'm not sure I can do portraits...I like to paint animals...tigers, lions, etc...

cya again...sorry everyone about the double post. I hit refresh button...

[eurydice]

I looked for The Story on that site but couldn't find it. I didn't do anything today. Mostly I eat broiled meat or fish for supper with vegetables too. I was also admiring the Jean-Leon Gerome paintings he did in Cairo on that site. He's got ones of tigers and lions. I wasn't really hungry today either. These thyroid pills make me feel weird, I had to take some xanax because I couldnt' breathe. I dont' know what a person's supposed to do if they have a high TSH, but can't take thyroid medication. My roomate has been to south Texas and said he was at a park called Big Bend and that he was really impressed by it. I'm going to take an amitriptyline tonight I think. Take care.

[summer*rai]

hi eury...how did the amytriptline work???...I hope you had a good day...Was cold and rainy here today...but somehow made it through the day without cheating...I am wondering if I may be using too much splenda...I really don't think so..a cup of splenda has 24 grams of carbs..that's alot of splenda...I'm just not gonna give up my coffee..however, I've cut out my diet drinks...drinking mostly water and hot tea...

[didi3]

Hi there, I stopped taking my prozax when I started the Atkins plan. Have been taking Methotrexate injects for 3 years but had stopped taking them (developed an HUGE aversion to needles). Had to return to the injections because I was in LOTS of pain! It will take several weeks to kick in again. HATE to go to the doctor (no insurance). Guess I learned my lesson the hard way! Hopefully I will start to feel better soon. At least I'm losing weight!! ( (Which really helps to keep my mood and attitude better) :D

[Gnasher]

Can somebody please tell me why people with depression go for low carb diets? I thought that carbs converted into serotonin, which is what we depressives are short of? Please can someone explain. Thx. :eek:

[summer*rai]

All I know is that I no longer have the mood swings.....I think mine has come when I have such sugar swings say a low of 45 and a high of 285....The carbs kept me on a roller coaster...Dizzyness..headache, shakes...can't think straight...etc...This is a fibromyalgia thread....fibro is something thatis bad enough in it's self...Just not being able to do your normal activities can make you even more depressed...My rheumatologist thinks the diet is a great diet..You should check with your doctor and see what he recommends....Lot's of our meds cause fibro patients gain weight...The antidepressants help me not to feel the pain...but doctor says it can't MAKE you gain weight, but it can get you hungry...a little pill just can't do that...but he told me and pointed to my atkins diet book...when your hungry do what the book says...It the low carb way...

[keely99]

Perhaps I can simplify your question about low carbs and depression.
A lack of protein can sap your energy levels which, in turn, can lead to depression.
Carbohydrates - nutritional info. on the back of your food shows what percentage of your carbs are attained from sugar. Making sure to eat low-glycemic carbs (brown rice, whole wheat products, etc.) rather than high glycemic carbs (white bread, potatoes, white rice, etc.) Much like a mood-enhancing drug, high glycemic carbs give you a rush of energy - only to leave you feeling tired and sluggish later on. High levels of sugar in the diet are one of the primary causes of irritability and depression. Conversely, low-glycemic carbs give out a steady stream of energy throughout the day.

Eating Carbs to increase Serotonin is good...but they have to be the right amount of carbs and in combination with other foods to benefit.
Most people who suffer with depression choose the WRONG carbs, not their fault...it is a comfort thing. Atkins gives us the RIGHT carbs or rather the right amount to start a reformation processs.
I hope this helps.

[quietone]

Let me see if I can respond in a way that makes sense.

I can't do extreme low carb. I get zapped of energy, mentally dumbfounded, etc. etc.

I am a depressive.

Simple carbs are very bad, yet very addictive for depressive types. It lifts your mood (if you are not insuling resistant). I am IR. Simple carbs make me feel crappy. And bloated the next morning.

Now. Carbs do not allow your body to produce serotonin, if there is ANY protein in your stomach when you eat them. Yet, you can not product serotonin if you do not have other precursors (such as tryptophan) which are found in protein/meat. There's the rub.

Now. Most fibromyalgia sufferers are also low on norepinehrine. (Which is why effexor works so well for these sufferers.). That is one of the reasons why we have pain.

So...most authors that are proponents of natural remedies for depression and/or fibro, say to eat at least one meal a day in which there is no protein. But not simple carbs, or high glycemic carbs.

Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah

The one thing that raises serotinin, norephinephrine, dopamine, stops insuling resistance, heart disease and cancer is...exercise!